KCRag Forum

SOM has studied a gondola system for KCMO ans KCK similar to what is in Bogota.

https://cityscenekc.com/gondola-linking ... -official/

I hope they find a way, if it's built, to integrate the terminus in DTKC at a streetcar stop. I think it would greatly affect ridership.

Gondola system in La Paz Bolivia is the coolest thing I've ever been on. The system is huge. Especially useful when walking in a city that is 12000 ft high.

Claims half the cost per mile than streetcar. And yeah they should estimate to Main St to connect to streetcar, or at least plan for a potential extension.

I think I'd rather see a single stop in West Bottoms and terminus in City Market to connect with the streetcar, even if that means navigating over the new Broadway Bridge interchange and dealing with downtown airport flight paths.

Cue a new Clay Chastain proposal.

kcjak wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:30 am I think I'd rather see a single stop in West Bottoms and terminus in City Market to connect with the streetcar, even if that means navigating over the new Broadway Bridge interchange and dealing with downtown airport flight paths.

Cue a new Clay Chastain proposal.

That would bring it too close to the airport

kcjak wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:30 am I think I'd rather see a single stop in West Bottoms and terminus in City Market to connect with the streetcar, even if that means navigating over the new Broadway Bridge interchange and dealing with downtown airport flight paths.

Another option is to terminate near 8th/Broadway with a strategic plan for a ped only street along 8th to Main St as perhaps targeting downtown's main shopping strip in the long term. The upside is that it will spurn more foot traffic between the connections and encourage more development along 8th.

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:30 am

kcjak wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:30 am I think I'd rather see a single stop in West Bottoms and terminus in City Market to connect with the streetcar, even if that means navigating over the new Broadway Bridge interchange and dealing with downtown airport flight paths.

Cue a new Clay Chastain proposal.

That would bring it too close to the airport

Could they make this project part of the removal of North Loop running it where the trench is now?

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:37 am

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:30 am

kcjak wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:30 am I think I'd rather see a single stop in West Bottoms and terminus in City Market to connect with the streetcar, even if that means navigating over the new Broadway Bridge interchange and dealing with downtown airport flight paths.

Cue a new Clay Chastain proposal.

That would bring it too close to the airport

Could they make this project part of the removal of North Loop running it where the trench is now?

That makes a big lift a massive lift

normalthings wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 10:02 am That makes a big lift a massive lift

Idk, turning it a little to the north to hit 70 wouldn’t take much work and would allow connection at 8th and Main streetcar with no worry about buildings in the way. Where it connects DT now would make it not able to extend due to buildings in the path.

Like a new version of the 9th St incline plus a leftover from a world's fair.

earthling wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:00 am

This alignment, while not the only option, does stay within the public right-of-way.

this would be so goddamn cool.

How much are these things affected by adverse weather? This route would be only touristy frou-frou unless it connects to something. This route does not on either end. Needs to go over to Main in KCMO and 7th in KCK.

moderne wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:50 pm How much are these things affected by adverse weather? This route would be only touristy frou-frou unless it connects to something. This route does not on either end. Needs to go over to Main in KCMO and 7th in KCK.

I agree. Very few people will ever care about using this route meaningfully- if you make a gondola you put it somewhere where it'd be really used.

moderne wrote: ↑Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:50 pm How much are these things affected by adverse weather? This route would be only touristy frou-frou unless it connects to something. This route does not on either end. Needs to go over to Main in KCMO and 7th in KCK.

Probably greatly impacted by wind. I'd rather see a streetcar. Don't really see the point of gondolas in urban areas unless there is considerable relief. The bigger issue, as you point out, is who is actually going from KCK to KCMO? A streetcar would allow for TOD along the route but a Gondola usually just has a terminus on either end with nothing in between.

^Agree streetcar would be more ideal but if true this is half the cost per mile then it might end up as a compromise. The article said it 'could' include two stops in W Bottoms but that might shrink the cost savings quite a bit (such as possibly maintaining elevators to high platforms). Would be interesting to see detailed studies/estimates for both, including long term operations/maintenance.

Assuming the purported cost savings are real, and provided they build the intermediate stops shown on the map instead of just a single point-to-point line, I don't really have a problem with building a gondola in lieu of a streetcar, though I agree that it should be extended to points people will actually travel between instead of just stopping at the edge of the bluffs. Vancouver is building one that can supposedly handle winds of up to 100kph, so I wouldn't expect it to be impacted by run of the mill bad weather. Assuming they keep the intermediate stops, and assuming ridership for either mode would be comparable, I don't really see why a streetcar would do better at creating TOD than the gondola. Of course, there's a lot of "assuming" and "provided that" in this post, and I'm not going to dive too deeply into what is likely to be vaporware, but I'm tentatively positive about the idea.

It's a neat idea, and one that I am glad they looked at a bit deeper. It shows that creativity & innovation are still percolating. However there is very little chance this goes anywhere beyond the proposal stage.

Maybe if Strawberry Hill and surrounding neighborhood continue to to develop, and thrive, it may drive more population to the area. But unfortunately most of KCK in that area continues to struggle with crime & negative socioeconomic impacts that will take decades to fix, even with the progress they are making now.

Maybe a fun tourist connector from downtown to West Bottoms would work, especially give the new developed, planned developed etc. But again it's not a slam dunk.

But all said it is a neat idea and I encourage leaders to keep coming up with new ideas and innovations.