Streetcar to the riverfront

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normalthings
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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by normalthings » Fri Sep 14, 2018 10:48 am

Does anyone know the reason why they are choosing a concrete slab(expensive) over traditional ballast +ties(cheaper) for the actual river front portion of the expansion?

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by DaveKCMO » Fri Sep 14, 2018 10:06 pm

normalthings wrote:
Fri Sep 14, 2018 10:48 am
Does anyone know the reason why they are choosing a concrete slab(expensive) over traditional ballast +ties(cheaper) for the actual river front portion of the expansion?
So you don't trip over it when walking through the park. You could also bike/scoot across it. Also, it's not *that* much cheaper and there's less expansion in the heat/cold.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by normalthings » Sat Sep 15, 2018 8:31 am

Cool. Thanks. I had imagined it had to do with either pedestrians or aesthetics

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by DaveKCMO » Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:46 am


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normalthings
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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by normalthings » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:32 pm

Does this project 100% require a grant?

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by mgh7676 » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:51 pm

normalthings wrote:
Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:32 pm
Does this project 100% require a grant?
“We’re still actively working with the Port KC and the city on the funding and financing plan that would leverage revenue capture from other sources,” Gerend said.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by taxi » Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:56 pm

They can't even afford to keep bags in the dog poop bag dispensers. How are they gonna afford a streetcar?

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by DaveKCMO » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:03 pm

It could be built -- without federal involvement -- for what the city is spending to build a parking garage at 3rd and grand.

:shock:

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by beautyfromashes » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:10 pm

I don’t really get this extension. I understand the money was there due to extra tax revenue received in the district, but shouldn’t this have been paid for solely by the casino and Riverfront authority? They are the true benefactors.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by normalthings » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:13 pm

beautyfromashes wrote:
Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:10 pm
I don’t really get this extension. I understand the money was there due to extra tax revenue received in the district, but shouldn’t this have been paid for solely by the casino and Riverfront authority? They are the true benefactors.
The line doesn’t run to the casino (yet). The only group that benefits as of now is the Port Of KC who plans on selling/leasing adjacent lots.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by beautyfromashes » Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:15 pm

normalthings wrote:
Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:13 pm
The line doesn’t run to the casino (yet). The only group that benefits as of now is the Port Of KC who plans on selling/leasing adjacent lots.
It just seems like the excess revenue could have been spent on something more useful. It seems it burned a hole in someone’s pocket or they were worried about the city government trying to pull the extra revenue back.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by kboish » Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:02 am

taxi wrote:
Fri Dec 14, 2018 5:56 pm
They can't even afford to keep bags in the dog poop bag dispensers. How are they gonna afford a streetcar?
The Port Authority partnered with the city to form the original TDD so they have a say in how the funds the TDD generates are spent.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by FangKC » Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:01 pm

It makes sense. The secondary purpose of a line is to stimulate development of real estate. Thousands of people may live and work there. Here you have a great deal of land on which to build new. A casino at the end of the line might help the hotels along the line (and the weakest casino --the only one in Jackson County btw).

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by normalthings » Sat Dec 15, 2018 11:46 pm

FangKC wrote:
Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:01 pm
It makes sense. The secondary purpose of a line is to stimulate development of real estate. Thousands of people may live and work there. Here you have a great deal of land on which to build new. A casino at the end of the line might help the hotels along the line (and the weakest casino --the only one in Jackson County btw).
Yes. However, everything thy have proposed so far involves massive parking garages/lots and relatively lowrise structures. Building a line to the Riverfront doesn’t make sense if they are going to fill the area with suburban style developments

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by earthling » Sun Dec 16, 2018 8:58 am

Lost opportunity with turning riverfront into another downtown urban district. At best it might become a suburban lifestyle center.

But streetcar through riverfront could still have a purpose. Effective metro wide transit isn't getting metro support so would propose building mega city garages at riverfront near Paseo bridge exits with streetcar into downtown. This would help keep cars out of downtown and help downtown developers build projects w/out need for parking.

An 18th/Vine to SWBlvd/Stateline streetcar line could serve this purpose too. Mega city garages near I35/State Line area and 71hwy/18th would help keep cars coming from E/W out of downtown.

The City could lease garage spots to both businesses and residents as well as event parking.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by normalthings » Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:16 pm

The reason why we have soo much more parking than needed downtown is because people want to park at their office/apartment/store. People don’t want to walk, bike, transit from “remote” parking lots.

Park and Rides take funds away from transit, space away from housing, and promote suburban commuting while adding a limited number of riders.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by earthling » Sun Dec 16, 2018 12:22 pm

I agree with you but KC is nowhere near creating the ideal. For the most part downtown projects still aren't built w/out parking. Better to place cars on the outskirts of downtown than continue to build parking inside downtown and the latter is likely to continue if we don't leverage streetcar.

Look at the new Copaken office project. They moved with the one that gets garage help at 13th/Main rather than at Grand. And there's more footprint of garage than the office building.

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Re: Streetcar to the riverfront

Post by FangKC » Sun Dec 16, 2018 7:39 pm

Take your argument to the banks. Many of the problems stem from lending institutions that require onsite parking before they will provide loans.

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