Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Discussion about new sports facilities in Kansas City
mykn
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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by mykn » Thu Sep 06, 2018 4:16 pm

Let's just replace the Costco/Home Depot with a stadium and be done with it.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by flyingember » Thu Sep 06, 2018 6:17 pm

smh wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 3:50 pm
flyingember wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:08 pm
smh wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:51 pm
I'm all for downtown-ish baseball, but I'd prefer not have it a block from my house.
NIMBY!
Sigh. In this case I must admit it.

I feel like the negative externalities of 20,000 people a block away 82 days a year would just be a little much.

"But Wrigleyville!" Yeah, I dunno.
It is admittedly a difficult subject for a neighborhood.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by chingon » Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:58 am

TheLastGentleman wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 3:56 pm
Also, Wrigley isn't exactly in the middle of downtown
Also wrigleyville is fucking horrible.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by WoodDraw » Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:06 pm

Oh come on, it's fine as a neighborhood and serves a purpose for people there. I have no problem with a drunk, young, sports neighborhood. I just have no faith that KC will pull it off.

I see a stadium surrounded by parking lots and garages. Also, Kansas City isn't Chicago. Putting a stadium in the middle of downtown is a bigger deal.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by ToDactivist » Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:56 pm

WoodDraw wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:06 pm
Oh come on, it's fine as a neighborhood and serves a purpose for people there. I have no problem with a drunk, young, sports neighborhood. I just have no faith that KC will pull it off.

I see a stadium surrounded by parking lots and garages. Also, Kansas City isn't Chicago. Putting a stadium in the middle of downtown is a bigger deal.
nooth loop stop is already replete with underused parking garages - commerce - catholics - denizen - library - ymca - others plus (sub)surface parking under I-70 lid when this happens at same time. no new parking needed is concept plus that streetcar thingy....

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by smh » Sat Sep 08, 2018 5:25 pm

ToDactivist wrote:
Sat Sep 08, 2018 12:56 pm
WoodDraw wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 12:06 pm
Oh come on, it's fine as a neighborhood and serves a purpose for people there. I have no problem with a drunk, young, sports neighborhood. I just have no faith that KC will pull it off.

I see a stadium surrounded by parking lots and garages. Also, Kansas City isn't Chicago. Putting a stadium in the middle of downtown is a bigger deal.
nooth loop stop is already replete with underused parking garages - commerce - catholics - denizen - library - ymca - others plus (sub)surface parking under I-70 lid when this happens at same time. no new parking needed is concept plus that streetcar thingy....
I'd rather it go in a downtown adjacent, but less developed area. This would have massive impacts to the surroundings residential areas...not to mention turning Delaware into Wrigleyville. I'm just not sure that's what we want for the area. It also rewards decades of Kemper landbanking which I'm not crazy about either.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by TheLastGentleman » Sat Sep 08, 2018 5:43 pm

I wrote this on the flashcube thread but I'm just gonna leave it here where it's also relevant.
TheLastGentleman wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 12:53 am
Image

This is probably the most detailed depiction of this scheme I've come across. Notice that they have to intrude upon freeway space here, even after demolishing both the flashcube and 609 central. Assuming the flashcube is kept, the only way this plan could even be plausible would be if the north loop was removed and the stadium was partially sat on the land. If that occurred, though, it would negate a benefit of having the thing in that location in the first place, that being freeway access. It would still require 609's demolition. I'm sorry, but I'd hate seeing a last remnant of an otherwise obliterated neighborhood be demolished for schlock like this.

Image

I still have yet to fathom why this particular site is so attractive to people here. The grid is already so thoroughly wrecked around there; why do we need to plop a huge superblock in there (which would also need an huge amount of adjacent parking, mind you) when we have an opportunity to right such a major wrong? Wouldn't it just be rewarding the people who have been landbanking this area for so long, who've kept it a dormant division between two of downtown's most critical neighborhoods for the last half century? It's insane.

Even if it takes the better part of a century to see this area develop into a neighborhood, I'd still say it's worth avoiding having a stadium jammed into it.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by normalthings » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:22 pm

Project Price is now over $800million. Opportunity zones are being looked at due to potential financial bonuses. The East Loop and West Bottoms areas are both opportunity zones. West Bottoms sounds like the better option to me. Opinions?

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by TheLastGentleman » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:03 pm

normalthings wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:22 pm
Project Price is now over $800million. Opportunity zones are being looked at due to potential financial bonuses. The East Loop and West Bottoms areas are both opportunity zones. West Bottoms sounds like the better option to me. Opinions?
K E E P I T O U T O F T H E L O O P

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by grovester » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:20 pm

normalthings wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:22 pm
Project Price is now over $800million. Opportunity zones are being looked at due to potential financial bonuses. The East Loop and West Bottoms areas are both opportunity zones. West Bottoms sounds like the better option to me. Opinions?
I thought it was West Side, not West Bottoms?

edit: found it "...one is a several block corridor on the west side of Broadway between I-670 and Southwest Boulevard. "

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by alejandro46 » Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:55 pm

Keep it where it is at please. I know that neighborhood sucks, but what additional bars, restaurants, and new hotels on all the parking seas around the complex in addition to some renovations? $800m for a new stadium is not a wise use of money imo.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by WSPanic » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:01 pm

If taxes are expected to pay for it, I'm out. Keep it out in the boonies and renovate.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by DaveKCMO » Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:13 am

WSPanic wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:01 pm
If taxes are expected to pay for it, I'm out. Keep it out in the boonies and renovate.
You can expect that. It's on trend.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by WSPanic » Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:26 am

DaveKCMO wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:13 am
WSPanic wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:01 pm
If taxes are expected to pay for it, I'm out. Keep it out in the boonies and renovate.
You can expect that. It's on trend.
Put it in JoCo or the The Legends - let those suckers pony up for a change.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by DaveKCMO » Mon Jan 14, 2019 9:49 pm

WSPanic wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 10:26 am
DaveKCMO wrote:
Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:13 am
WSPanic wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:01 pm
If taxes are expected to pay for it, I'm out. Keep it out in the boonies and renovate.
You can expect that. It's on trend.
Put it in JoCo or the The Legends - let those suckers pony up for a change.
I doubt current or future ownership would want that, but if it happens --- so be it!

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by bobbyhawks » Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:07 pm

I'd put it in the West Bottoms close to Hy Vee Arena, with one side of the stadium in Kansas and the other in Missouri (hello bi-state tax). Parking space can be found/already exists and can be purchased or borrowed from Hy Vee Arena with the possibility of a streetcar spur over time. Offices can be placed in Kansas to avoid KCMO taxes, or the Royals have lots of options for taking advantage of being in both states (or some agreement would have to be made between the jurisdictions). The 3rd base line will be the actual state line. Upper level seating will have a downtown skyline view. With the arena, it can be a year-round sports district, and there is a lot of space for development, including some of the stuff planned already between Kansas and Missouri. There is more possibility to use some of the money develop the nearby river and make it more beautiful (rather than a large wall of gravel).

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by flyingember » Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:38 pm

To move 10,000 people in 60 minutes takes 20 trains departing every 60 seconds.

The existing stadiums and parking takes up 220 acres
The entire area between HyVee Arena and 670 (excluding the train tracks) is 110 acres.

If parking isn't added we need transit of course.

150 people per train.
Let's say we want to move 10,000 people in an hour
That's a packed train leaving every 60 seconds

We're not close to the scale of supporting a stadium with only 1/3 of capacity going by train.

This means figuring out parking for 20,000 cars.

And for 20,000 cars there's two ways out. Liberty St to 18th to I-35. This is for all northland bound cars
Wyoming to 670 for SB 35 and everyone going E-W
Cesar Chavez for some

That's much easier if it's put somewhere that we can come close to using the spaces the rest of the time or can be served by multiple transit modes. Paseo West makes much more sense.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by alejandro46 » Tue Jan 15, 2019 8:47 pm

bobbyhawks wrote:
Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:07 pm
I'd put it in the West Bottoms close to Hy Vee Arena, with one side of the stadium in Kansas and the other in Missouri (hello bi-state tax). Parking space can be found/already exists and can be purchased or borrowed from Hy Vee Arena with the possibility of a streetcar spur over time. Offices can be placed in Kansas to avoid KCMO taxes, or the Royals have lots of options for taking advantage of being in both states (or some agreement would have to be made between the jurisdictions). The 3rd base line will be the actual state line. Upper level seating will have a downtown skyline view. With the arena, it can be a year-round sports district, and there is a lot of space for development, including some of the stuff planned already between Kansas and Missouri. There is more possibility to use some of the money develop the nearby river and make it more beautiful (rather than a large wall of gravel).
Genius... request $400mil in STAR Bonds and probably get approved. Better investment than the *insert boring no-name hockey/family attraction/arena suburban sprawl attraction here* that they've poured money into.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by bobbyhawks » Tue Jan 15, 2019 10:27 pm

flyingember wrote:
Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:38 pm
To move 10,000 people in 60 minutes takes 20 trains departing every 60 seconds.
Streetcar service wouldn't be designed with the purpose or capability of moving an entire stadium worth of people from downtown. That wouldn't make sense anyhow. It would connect the district, though, during all of the hours when there aren't games.
flyingember wrote:
Tue Jan 15, 2019 3:38 pm
The existing stadiums and parking takes up 220 acres
The entire area between HyVee Arena and 670 (excluding the train tracks) is 110 acres.
Royals games do not require near the parking that the entire complex offers, and tailgating is not really much of a thing for baseball. There is plenty of space to accommodate tailgaters in the bottoms. Half the space would be totally sufficient, and there are a ton more spillover options with buses, etc., in the bottoms. There are other options, and I'm sure some are easier, but if you start rationalizing moving the stadium to the easiest place, downtown ends up being a dumb option. I can still be convinced the bottoms are a bad idea, and I think there are other good ideas for the downtown area, but I think you have to think big before you think rationally. Otherwise, we'll just end up with a Corporate Woods boring JoCo stadium. If they ever decide to re-route I-35 more to the West of downtown, it would actually sweep right by the potential new location.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by shinatoo » Wed Jan 16, 2019 9:31 am

The trend is for smaller stadiums too. So like would be in the 30-35k seats size.
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