Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Discussion about new sports facilities in Kansas City
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DaveKCMO
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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by DaveKCMO » Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:51 am

earthling wrote:While I wouldn't be entirely against a downtown stadium, more hotels/residents/offices would be a better use of space. The TSC location is poor though.
I'm sure you'd be against it when the inevitable ask for public subsidy is revealed.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by earthling » Sat Jul 14, 2018 9:53 am

Likely.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by WoodDraw » Sat Jul 14, 2018 12:12 pm

I think the Royals missed their opportunity for a new stadium downtown. And I'm not in love with any of the locations proposed anyway.

I'm not sure you could get to 50% these days even if you only asked the urban core.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by warwickland » Sat Jul 14, 2018 6:35 pm

i've always thought that a new stadium should be in the sort of south/southeast corner of the crossroads where there is an offensive amount of almost nothing but parking lots. it would be within walking distance of vastly underutilized, extant parking/parking garages and some transit, including now the new streetcar...and lots of bars/restaurants.

there would be a wonderful view of the kc skyline + vital connectivity yet not intrude on the higher use potential of the loop...

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by StL_Dan » Wed Jul 18, 2018 5:05 pm

This is exactly where I have always envisioned a downtown stadium in KC being built. Not sure why there are high rises directly north of the stadium in your rendering cutting off the view of downtown, but, otherwise it's exactly as I've envisioned it since working near Wash Park back in the late 90's/early 2000's.
normalthings wrote:2005 Royals Washington Park Site Overview
Image

My 2018 Updated Renderings

View from West/Southwest
Image
View from the bottom of the memorial
Image
Union Hill Aerial
Image
Northeast Aerial
Image
Link to all images
https://imgur.com/a/ZQJR3w4

Please let me know what you think of this. Suggestions are welcomed. I could make something like this for the Northloop as well.

The stadium itself is very similar to Wrigley in Chicago. A lack of horizontal space is combatted by moving support areas and such(kitchens, dinning rooms, etc) below grade. The site has a lot of below grade space that can be utilized for such purposes.

I removed the game day plaza to allow for more seating and hotels/apartments/office spaces and associated spaces. Every potential revenue producing space must be capitalized on inorder to make the financing for this project work.

Why this site?:
1. The land is already owned by KCMO and Union Station.
2. No highway removal is required to get this going, unlike the northloop site.
3.The parcels included in my plan are hard to activate, unlike the North loop which would already have been built on by now.
5. I believe a Northloop stadium would turn into a sprawling suburban site in a prime downtown location. The limitations of the Washington Park site make sure the stadium and associated structures do not sprawl.

Worries: Traffic is definitely a concern at this site. Main should be closed to cars on game day to 1. preserve streetcar performance and 2. serve as a sort of pedestrian zone. This plan relies on a streetcar expansion, bussing, and hopefully LR to make the car problem manageable.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by normalthings » Sat Jul 21, 2018 10:52 am

I included the high rises as a way for the park to get revenues from alternative sources.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by flyingember » Sun Jul 22, 2018 9:44 am

Obviously that site won’t happen because neither the city or Union Station own all the land/buildings but the idea of adding new buildings to go with a stadium isn’t a bad idea. I seem to recall seeing this idea in a concept stadium somewhere

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by StL_Dan » Sun Jul 22, 2018 5:26 pm

If that is what it takes to get one done, I’d be all for it.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by shinatoo » Fri Aug 31, 2018 8:07 am

You know where there is plenty of room for a stadium? Southeast of 14th and Genessee.

Aprox view from mid level behind home plate.

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Quocunque Jeceris Stabit

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by flyingember » Fri Aug 31, 2018 8:25 am

shinatoo wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 8:07 am
You know where there is plenty of room for a stadium? Southeast of 14th and Genessee.
This isn't remotely a doable spot.

It's on an airport runway approach and the second the FAA has an interest you can expect them to be against it.
There's only one practical access point back to the rest of the city and EB on 670 drops to one lane and that's also how to get to 35 NB. Getting back home would take hours for some.
It has all the failings of Kemper Arena in terms of what's not around it.
You're unlikely to see any real interest in putting a major new city facility into an area that could flood.
It breaks up the grid dramatically, meaning there's only one road to the south remaining, need to take out Wyoming and Liberty

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by ToDactivist » Fri Aug 31, 2018 1:23 pm

StL_Dan wrote:
Wed Jul 18, 2018 5:05 pm
This is exactly where I have always envisioned a downtown stadium in KC being built. Not sure why there are high rises directly north of the stadium in your rendering cutting off the view of downtown, but, otherwise it's exactly as I've envisioned it since working near Wash Park back in the late 90's/early 2000's.
normalthings wrote:2005 Royals Washington Park Site Overview
Image

My 2018 Updated Renderings

View from West/Southwest
Image
View from the bottom of the memorial
Image
Union Hill Aerial
Image
Northeast Aerial
Image
Link to all images
https://imgur.com/a/ZQJR3w4

Please let me know what you think of this. Suggestions are welcomed. I could make something like this for the Northloop as well.

The stadium itself is very similar to Wrigley in Chicago. A lack of horizontal space is combatted by moving support areas and such(kitchens, dinning rooms, etc) below grade. The site has a lot of below grade space that can be utilized for such purposes.

I removed the game day plaza to allow for more seating and hotels/apartments/office spaces and associated spaces. Every potential revenue producing space must be capitalized on inorder to make the financing for this project work.

Why this site?:
1. The land is already owned by KCMO and Union Station.
2. No highway removal is required to get this going, unlike the northloop site.
3.The parcels included in my plan are hard to activate, unlike the North loop which would already have been built on by now.
5. I believe a Northloop stadium would turn into a sprawling suburban site in a prime downtown location. The limitations of the Washington Park site make sure the stadium and associated structures do not sprawl.

Worries: Traffic is definitely a concern at this site. Main should be closed to cars on game day to 1. preserve streetcar performance and 2. serve as a sort of pedestrian zone. This plan relies on a streetcar expansion, bussing, and hopefully LR to make the car problem manageable.
Yes I like to see a north loop rendering! Had seen one in past but faced wrong way. must be NE of course. and should fit maybe with overhang onto Main for all weather trolley stop. remove flash cube of course. parking under newly covered i-70.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by WoodDraw » Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:16 pm

My big worry about building the stadium downtown is how much parking they're going to want, and how much surface parking they'll want.

I would have loved a downtown stadium before, but I think that was the chance. We're doing just fine without it. If it does come downtown, I want it to be on our terms, not theirs.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by ToDactivist » Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:47 pm

WoodDraw wrote:
Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:16 pm
My big worry about building the stadium downtown is how much parking they're going to want, and how much surface parking they'll want.

I would have loved a downtown stadium before, but I think that was the chance. We're doing just fine without it. If it does come downtown, I want it to be on our terms, not theirs.
Agreed on terms...get it away from Glass(?) first. Parking solved easily in the ULI I-70 transformation. Really the only solution that seems viable for transit, ingress/egress, parking, open spaces, rehab or adjacent areas = prop tax rev, sale tax rev, land sales from newly formed deck over parking. duh.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by flyingember » Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:27 pm

I would trade a stadium for transit system funding.

Roll a streetcar line extension into construction, bus line improvements, commuter rail financial support if it's in the right spot.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by ToDactivist » Sat Sep 01, 2018 7:01 pm

why either or? Denver did all and look where it went. Airport, People Mover then Light Rail, Downtown stadiums - all three. thats a commitment to an vibrant urban lifestyle.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by flyingember » Sat Sep 01, 2018 9:06 pm

ToDactivist wrote:
Sat Sep 01, 2018 7:01 pm
why either or? Denver did all and look where it went. Airport, People Mover then Light Rail, Downtown stadiums - all three. thats a commitment to an vibrant urban lifestyle.
Sorry, I meant more in the idea of each gives and gets something.

The team gets a stadium with pairing and the city gets transit funding from the team.
Eventually need to expand the type of funding sources available.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by smh » Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:51 pm

I'm all for downtown-ish baseball, but I'd prefer not have it a block from my house.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by flyingember » Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:08 pm

smh wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:51 pm
I'm all for downtown-ish baseball, but I'd prefer not have it a block from my house.
NIMBY!

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by smh » Thu Sep 06, 2018 3:50 pm

flyingember wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 1:08 pm
smh wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 12:51 pm
I'm all for downtown-ish baseball, but I'd prefer not have it a block from my house.
NIMBY!
Sigh. In this case I must admit it.

I feel like the negative externalities of 20,000 people a block away 82 days a year would just be a little much.

"But Wrigleyville!" Yeah, I dunno.

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Re: Would you like to see the Royals move to a downtown stadium?

Post by TheLastGentleman » Thu Sep 06, 2018 3:56 pm

Also, Wrigley isn't exactly in the middle of downtown

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