KCRag Forum

I don't know why more people aren't talking about this. http://news.independent.co.uk/sci_tech/ ... 656034.ece
One would think people in this city would get motivated one of these days about mass transit.

Oh, good, when the world is out of Oil, the debate about fossil fuels causing Global Warming will be superfluous.

Will humans have colonized the Moon and exploited all its resources by then?

The real answer is just like the global warming debate... are we closer today to running out of oil than we were yesterday?  Yes, but just how far away it is nobody can really prove.  In this situation the oil companies really don't have much to lose here, they would actually profit heavily from the mass hysteria caused by the notion that oil will run out in a few years. 

jlbomega wrote: The real answer is just like the global warming debate... are we closer today to running out of oil than we were yesterday?  Yes, but just how far away it is nobody can really prove.  In this situation the oil companies really don't have much to lose here, they would actually profit heavily from the mass hysteria caused by the notion that oil will run out in a few years. 

Assuming it is true, In the short term  profits may increase for Oil industires but there are many economic consequences that would be realized too, most of them negative. For instance, What happens to air travel?

We have lots of fat people. Perhaps we can return to blubber. 

I have a feeling that we are going to be digging up a lot of our dumps recycling buried plastic.  Will hobos kill each other for the other's stash of plastic beer ringers?

Looks like we'll be going back to glass containers again.

I saw something on TV the other day about how they dumped millions of tires into the ocean hoping to create a reef. It ended up never developing and killing the existing reefs.  Looks like we'll be pulling those up at some point.

Our president needs to get off his ass and push investment in solar energy -- especially in American homes.  It's ridiculous that we have millions of rooftops that could be generating power, and aren't.  He also needs to impose some mandates on auto companies to convert to hybrid engines in every vehicle possible as soon as possible.

FangKC wrote: We have lots of fat people. Perhaps we can return to blubber.   :lol:

Yep, bio-fuels!

I highly recommend the book "The Long Emergency" by James Howard Kunstler.  It was written in 2005 and discusses the coming crisis when we no longer have millions of years worth of solar energy stored in a neatly packaged black liquid.  Furthermore, we're running out right at the moment when we'll need it the most:  global climate change (doesn't matter who-done-it, we still have to deal with the consequences), less available fresh water around the world, drug-resistant disease, and so on, all with a global population that is simply unsustainable without cheap access to the energy and manufactured products (like fertilizers, plastics, etc) provided by oil and natural gas.

Anyway, it's alarming stuff and it's very surprising we're not talking more about it or taking serious steps to deal with it.  A large section of the book is devoted to debunking the idea that some alternative energy source will be able to step in and take the place of oil/gas.  It's pretty dubious, (Nuclear powered airplanes??) not to mention that manufacturing solar panels, wind turbines, and especially dams and nuclear plans is heavily dependent on (cheap) oil inputs.  The end of oil will mark a drastic change in how we live our lives and it's likely to happen within the next 30-50 years.

Selected Excerpts

Amazon.com Link

My father rode a camel,
I drive a car,
My son flies a jet airplane...
and His son will ride a camel.  -Arabic Proverb

Fear is the best motivator.

My theory on oil is this, most oil producing nations in the world right now really do not know how much oil there is under the ground. The oil that is there is pumped at such a slow rate that it makes the big oil companies loads of money in the supply and demand market. If all of the oil on the planet earth would be pumped out of the ground We would probably have enough to last us for an eternity. This very earth that we live on is renewing every day with old growth forests depositing residue on the ground, the residue getting compacted, this compaction forcing the oils out of the residue, and finally all of the oil pooling in a nice little pool. We just have to keep the wells pumping to keep these pools open for more oil to settle in. The big oil companies are actually holding this supply hostage while America suffers.

anniewarbucks wrote: My theory on oil is this, most oil producing nations in the world right now really do not know how much oil there is under the ground. The oil that is there is pumped at such a slow rate that it makes the big oil companies loads of money in the supply and demand market. If all of the oil on the planet earth would be pumped out of the ground We would probably have enough to last us for an eternity. This very earth that we live on is renewing every day with old growth forests depositing residue on the ground, the residue getting compacted, this compaction forcing the oils out of the residue, and finally all of the oil pooling in a nice little pool. We just have to keep the wells pumping to keep these pools open for more oil to settle in. The big oil companies are actually holding this supply hostage while America suffers.

This is definitely not true. Oil cannot under any circumstances be replaced in a matter of decades - it took millions of years to create.

lol... ignorance... on occasion... makes me smile 

eliphar17 wrote: This is definitely not true. Oil cannot under any circumstances be replaced in a matter of decades - it took millions of years to create.

I thought about commenting on that this morning, but then I thought, "nah, it's just not worth it!"

anniewarbucks wrote: My theory on oil is this, most oil producing nations in the world right now really do not know how much oil there is under the ground. The oil that is there is pumped at such a slow rate that it makes the big oil companies loads of money in the supply and demand market. If all of the oil on the planet earth would be pumped out of the ground We would probably have enough to last us for an eternity. This very earth that we live on is renewing every day with old growth forests depositing residue on the ground, the residue getting compacted, this compaction forcing the oils out of the residue, and finally all of the oil pooling in a nice little pool. We just have to keep the wells pumping to keep these pools open for more oil to settle in. The big oil companies are actually holding this supply hostage while America suffers.

Sorry to say Annie but your theory is not accurate.  Oil is indeed being regenerated but not at the rate that it is going to benefit even our greatest grandchildren (nor is it ever generated by the method you suggest)....all that is replacing the produced oil in the world's oil fields is saltwater.  Big oil companies have a huge monkey on their back trying to replace the oil they produce on an annual basis.....without which, they slowly go out of business.  In fact, most large companies cannot replace their production by finding more oil in the ground.....that's why we see so many mergers.  For example, look at the rumor mill surrouding Shell and BP right now.     

As long as bottled water costs more than gasoline, as long as a Starbucks costs more than gasoline, as long as a beer at a sporting event costs more than gasoline, people will pay whatever it takes to go by car.

Besides, with the gasoline alternatives around and coming to market the auto will be here to stay.

Or we can just do what the French inventor has done and make our cars run on air

It actually is a cool thing, I am going to try and find that article again.

aknowledgeableperson wrote: As long as bottled water costs more than gasoline, as long as a Starbucks costs more than gasoline, as long as a beer at a sporting event costs more than gasoline, people will pay whatever it takes to go by car.

Yes, probably.

aknowledgeableperson wrote: Besides, with the gasoline alternatives around and coming to market the auto will be here to stay.

Your head is in the sand, as is the rest of the Panglossian Pollyanna contingent of uninformed blithering masses who all assume the transition from oil to some other super duper miracle energy source will swoop in and save American-style easy motoring and strip mall gulag retail just at the right moment.

Electric cars will be the next form of transportation, however IMO we will go through a lot of pain because of stupidity and lack of planning.

Geez, I don't understand why some people buy into any and every doomsday theory they can find.  Electric cars, hydrogen, gas electric, biofuel, etc.  There are plenty of alternatives out there and many could be easily used today.  The fact is the auto industry is in shambles (thus lack of necessary investment in alternative engines) and big oil is sqeezing every last penny they can get.

Bottom line is just like every other "crisis" in this world there will be a bunch of people who claim "the sky is falling" but in the end we will just move on to the next thing.  Y2K anyone?

jlbomega wrote: Geez, I don't understand why some people buy into any and every doomsday theory they can find.

'Cause it's an excuse to use silly words, with a little gob of white spittle forming on their lip as they type.

Did I say Doomsday or mention Mad Max? No. Will it fundamentally alter the way we live our lives, yes.