Page 3 of 36
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2011 9:19 pm
by AJoD
From IKEA's standpoint, I can see why they might not go into the West Bottoms, but I think it would be a terrific location for the city. It's not like IKEA demands a choice location. I wouldn't mind seeing them at Indian Springs Mall.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:48 am
by pash
.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:40 am
by aknowledgeableperson
FangKC wrote:I have no problem with the City issuing TIF to help pay off the new project--as might be done with any private new development.
The problem is what tax revenues do you propose to use?
Property Taxes - None. The rest of the complex is owned by the city. You might respond to give that also to the AR but the AR is not in a position to properly maintain the facilities and would not accept the transfer.
Earnings Tax - Very minimal. The facility is not blessed with year-round activity. And much of the activity that is there does not produce earnings that would be taxable.
Sales Taxes - Very minimal. Unless things have changed the AR is a tax-exempt organization and therefore there are no sales taxes on ticket sales. Moving the rodeo to the SC has greatly reduced the number of people visiting the complex and therefore reduced the sales taxes collected. And again the facility does not have year-round activity.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 8:46 am
by KCMax
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 9:23 am
by kboish
but where will people park?
This isn't anything super exciting or sexy, but at least it makes people at AR happy and is in line with the historic use of the area. Barring a major redevelopment (not likely anytime soon in this economy)or an IKEA (probably just as unlikely)going down there, this is probably as good a use as can be realistically expected for the area.
Will we then still be paying off bonds for a building that doesn't exist if we tear Kemper down?
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 9:33 am
by KCMax
kboish wrote:but where will people park?
This isn't anything super exciting or sexy, but at least it makes people at AR happy and is in line with the historic use of the area. Barring a major redevelopment (not likely anytime soon in this economy)or an IKEA (probably just as unlikely)going down there, this is probably as good a use as can be realistically expected for the area.
Will we then still be paying off bonds for a building that doesn't exist if we tear Kemper down?
Kauffman Stadium 20 years from now.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 11:59 am
by IraGlacialis
I always thought it would be cool if, in the event of a major overhaul of the AR, they bring back this style (of course, with an upgraded infrastructure):
Another image here:
http://www.vintagekansascity.com/1887/a ... lding.html
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 12:12 pm
by kboish
that would be cool. notice the streetcar and fountain in the pic...like that as a KC identity marker...loosely clothed nymphs (foreground) don't hurt either I suppose
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 7:20 pm
by shinatoo
how about keeping the exoskeleton up and hanging a tent like structure (AKA Denver airport) and having a covered outdoor event space. Like an amphitheater, or even the propose usage, a horse park. It would look cool, retain the iconic part of what was once a iconic building, serve multiple functions and be cheap to maintain.
You could even do a cool audio setup like the millennium park in Chicago.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 9:10 pm
by FangKC
Shinatoo, I thought the same think. Leave the exoskeleton up and reuse it somehow in the new concept.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:05 pm
by FangKC
aknowledgeableperson wrote:FangKC wrote:I have no problem with the City issuing TIF to help pay off the new project--as might be done with any private new development.
The problem is what tax revenues do you propose to use?
Property Taxes - None. The rest of the complex is owned by the city. You might respond to give that also to the AR but the AR is not in a position to properly maintain the facilities and would not accept the transfer.
Earnings Tax - Very minimal. The facility is not blessed with year-round activity. And much of the activity that is there does not produce earnings that would be taxable.
Sales Taxes - Very minimal. Unless things have changed the AR is a tax-exempt organization and therefore there are no sales taxes on ticket sales. Moving the rodeo to the SC has greatly reduced the number of people visiting the complex and therefore reduced the sales taxes collected. And again the facility does not have year-round activity.
The State might be able to kick in some incentives if the new project is tied to economic development by luring some agri-business/animal science concerns down to the West Bottoms around the existing complex, and can use the existing parking lots for their employees.
My point was that TIF could be used if other private agribusiness concerns could be lured down around the new project, and the TIF would help fund the AR project much like the Federal Reserve TIF helps Penn Valley Park. The sales, property, and earning taxes from those would contribute to the American Royal project.
There are several parcels around the Americal Royal that could be combined into a TIF district, and once agribusiness and animal science concern could be lured there using state and local incentives.
Area around American Royal.
Potential redevelopment sites near American Royal.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:20 pm
by IraGlacialis
FangKC wrote:
There are several parcels around the Americal Royal that could be combined into a TIF district, and once agribusiness and animal science concern could be lured there using state and local incentives.
Maybe some biotech companies as well.
kboish wrote:that would be cool. notice the streetcar and fountain in the pic...like that as a KC identity marker...
Apparently, that building actually was set up on the east side.
http://www.kclibrary.org/?q=blog/week-k ... /burnt-end
However, I think it would be appropriate to reinstall the cable car system that goes from DT to the West Bottoms, and it even better to have it go all the way to the AR.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:45 pm
by FangKC
That exposition building design turned out to be troublesome, since it was made of thousands of panes of glass, which were damaged in a big hail storm. I think there was no money to repair the structure, or will to do it because of future risk, so the building fell into disuse.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 1:48 am
by IraGlacialis
FangKC wrote:That exposition building design turned out to be troublesome, since it was made of thousands of panes of glass, which were damaged in a big hail storm. I think there was no money to repair the structure, or will to do it because of future risk, so the building fell into disuse.
Yeah. I'm well aware that the "Crystal Palace" design is unsustainable.
Still, I would highly be in favor of that architectural style (Queen Anne?), or elements of it, being brought back for such a structure. A more modest example, that is still in use, would the Coliseum at the Missouri State Fair (actually many of the early 20th brick building at the fair in general).
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 3:09 am
by FangKC
Yeah, at least the glass available today is much more durable.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:34 am
by FangKC
Star editorial calls on American Royal to build new facility with private funds.
http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/26/32 ... ivate.html
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:30 am
by taxi
Wouldn't this be a perfect location for Polsinelli, Schubert, Beethoven and Ego?
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 12:40 am
by pash
.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:31 am
by loftguy
.[/quote]I've also thought it would be great to leave the trusses standing. They're the most architecturally notable part of the design, and you would be able to do some cool stuff with them, as shinatoo suggests.
quote]
A really big swing set.
Re: American Royal leaders propose tearing down Kemper
Posted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 10:19 am
by KCMax
Collison: Could retrofitting prevent Kemper demolition?
Two concepts for revamping Kemper to make it work for the American Royal were suggested in that report.One called for creating a new enclosure in the existing structure that would lower the ceiling and cut off the top of the seating bowl, leaving the existing hockey-size floor intact and surrounded by 8,000 seats.
The other called for raising the floor and eliminating the lower seating bowl, putting the suite level next to the show ring and reducing capacity to 10,000 seats. In addition to fewer seats, the second option would create a larger floor more suitable for rodeos, 170 by 285 feet, and have room below to house animals, stage events and hold exhibitions.The study estimated either option could be done for less than $10 million.
Even with inflation, that’s a lot less than $70 million.
