www.SaveOurOwners.com

[KCDevin]

I have an arguement if they move there and they get a rolling roof... Then retail will pop up around it like Village West...

[kard]

What about the amount of business and retail that will mvoe to JoCo? That'd be away from jackson county and away from Downtown most importantly...

As far as i'm concerned, that fire hit the wrong part of Overland Park, it should have hit the campuses... Should have saved the historic part.

Did you just wish for a fire to destroy parts of OP?  Wow.  I'm not a huge fan of that burb, but I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

[KCDevin]

I didn't wish anything...
I was saying it would have been better if that had happened to the business campuses rather than Downtown OP... However, it would have harmed those businesses...

My point is, the shitty campuses and businesses like Sprint-Nextel and Executive Hills belong in Downtown Kansas City, not Overland Park or Johnson County.

[lock+load]

My point is, the shitty campuses and businesses like Sprint-Nextel and Executive Hills belong in Downtown Kansas City, not Overland Park or Johnson County.

This has nothing to do with the stadiums or the website.  Let's get it back on track.  Make your case using relevant facts.

[kard]

I didn't wish anything...
I was saying it would have been better if that had happened to the business campuses rather than Downtown OP... However, it would have harmed those businesses...

My point is, the shitty campuses and businesses like Sprint-Nextel and Executive Hills belong in Downtown Kansas City, not Overland Park or Johnson County.

I agree with you that those kind of businesses belong downtown--sorry to "twist" your words.  I also think the stadium(s) belong downtown.  Downtowns are places for people to live, work, and play.

Downtown Kansas City is in Jackson County, MO.  That's a fact.  But, if this town is dead-set on having suburban ballparks, what's the harm in JoCo paying either a relative share or for the whole thing (if the Chiefs "defect" and move there)  like Jackson County has been doing all these years, and are trying to be forced to again for the next 25 years?  Like most Johnson Countians (I'm generalizing), I see no problem with the stadiums being in a different county then the one I live in so long as it's in the metro.

[mean]

I have an arguement if they move there and they get a rolling roof... Then retail will pop up around it like Village West...

I'm sorry dude, I think you're way off. Retail didn't "pop up" around Village West, it was planned from the beginning, like Zona Rosa or Power & Light. That's not what I would call "popping up," and there is no proposal that I've seen to entice developers to come to TSC in the event of a rolling roof, like they made at ZR and P&L and VW. Unless you have some info I haven't seen, in which case, share!

[ComandanteCero]

A) I don't see the Chiefs or Royals leaving KC if this thing doesn't go through.  Guaranteed that's not going to happen because of this vote, and if it does by some strange aligning of the planets, good riddance.  Saying no is what is generally called "SPINE", in negotiations.  The teams want the tax payers to foot a billion dollars worth of improvements, that will directly benefit a private enterprise, and only indirectly (and tenuously) benefit citizens.  Shoot, for that kind of public money the city/county might as well buy both teams and run them themselves (like masstransit). 

B) A billion dollars could be spent on other capital intensive projects that would result in much greater direct and visible benefits to the public (i.e mass transit, education, infrastructure).

C) If this tax goes through, it almost guarantees the county and city will be taxed out for much more important projects/proposals in the near future.  You can basically kiss any talks of a light rail proposal in the coming years (2007-2008) good bye if you pass as massive a tax as this. 

D) This website is great, and I'm glad there's someone willing to lampoon the idiocy of this proposal.  I'm definitely hoping this fails miserably.

[chrizow]

the Pitch has a feature on the site.  it's funny/informative.  dig:  www.pitch.com

[bahua]

I'm sorry dude, I think you're way off.

You're a cunt!

[aknowledgeableperson]

I know you guys are feeling bad that I haven't posted for a few days but I have been busy.  Busy going through the City's proposed budget documents for its new fiscal year beginning 5-1-06.  There are some very interesting points in the document and in the City Auditor's comments about it.
I know that there are many reasons why people have taken a stand against this TSC proposal.  Some believe a downtown stadium will become a reality, if this issue does not pass, because the City will come to the rescue to build it since Barnes and Fairfield and Cauthen are for it and/or downtown.  I believe the reason why Barnes and Fairfield have come out in favor of the TSC issue and Cauthen is silent on it, is the probability that the City is unable to take on the debt load and that the TSC is the best option for KCMO as a whole.

From the City Auditor's Report at http://www.kcmo.org/auditor/05-06audits ... ew2007.pdf

"At the end of 2005, projected principal and interest payments on outstanding tax-supported debt reached about $2.3 billion, up from about $1 billion the year before."
And
"The City Manager identified about $126 Million in commitments the City has made but has not funded."
And
"Taxes used to fund public safety expire in about 10 years."
And
"Citizen surveys show low satisfaction with many services."
And
"The City's financial flexibility is limited."

Information from the Proposed City Budget, Economic Incentives at http://www.kcmo.org/manager/bdgt07/econinc.pdf

Economic incentives will generate $21,957,382 but payments will total $47,282,852.  The shortage the City needs to pay, that takes away from City operations, is $25,325,470.  I am not discussing the merits of the incentives, just stating their effects on the budget.  The budget does not break down the revenue generated by each project, just the cost for each.

FYI:
For those of you that are Urban Studies types an interesting document is: http://www.kcmo.org/manager/bdgt07/overview.pdf
Pages 27 through 32 discusses Super TIF's and TIF projects.

Given what is already on the City's plate it is very unlikely that its leaders are willing to take on the debt load a stadium would require.  That leaves the ball in the hands of Jackson County.  

[kcdcchef]

B) A billion dollars could be spent on other capital intensive projects that would result in much greater direct and visible benefits to the public (i.e mass transit, education, infrastructure).

the citzens of this region will NEVER pass a billion dollars in taxes in other projects, if you asked them to put up a billion for the schools, they woudl cite that the schools are corrupt, and they do not trust them. if you asked them for a bil for mass transit, they would tell you they should not have to pay for it, like the residents of gladstone, lees summit, independence, and blue springs did, in the last mass transit election. and if you asked them for a bil for infrastructure, they would cite corrupt politicians, and say because of them, they will not vote for it.

A) I don't see the Chiefs or Royals leaving KC if this thing doesn't go through. Guaranteed that's not going to happen because of this vote, and if it does by some strange aligning of the planets, good riddance. Saying no is what is generally called "SPINE", in negotiations. The teams want the tax payers to foot a billion dollars worth of improvements, that will directly benefit a private enterprise, and only indirectly (and tenuously) benefit citizens. Shoot, for that kind of public money the city/county might as well buy both teams and run them themselves (like masstransit).

this is the cost of keeping kansas city major league. that is fact. other cities our size, philly, pitt, toronto, san diego, seattle, have ponied up a LOT more then we are being asked to.

either way, the teams are asking for 450m, or 675m, not a billion. that, is propoganda. if you believe that, then you beleive that busch stadium in st louis is a 650m stadium, because it is bonded too.

[beautyfromashes]

You're a cunt!

Can you give yourself a warning?

[mean]

Well, he wasn't being serious, but still...

[mean]

Doh!

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/14109202.htm

[kcdcchef]

good. i hope the two of you, or three, get your asses nailed to the wall for some sort of wrongdoing. i hope you get a nice fine, in the 5 figure range.

[beautyfromashes]

good. i hope the two of you, or three, get your asses nailed to the wall for some sort of wrongdoing. i hope you get a nice fine, in the 5 figure range.

Are you that bitter of an asshole?  I understand disagreeing with someones opinion but to wish them financial attack at the hands of big business?  You're that petty?  There are so many worthwhile issues and problems to put your energy to.  Find one and attack it instead of the operator of a parody website.  That's just banging your head against the wall.

[chrizow]

good. i hope the two of you, or three, get your asses nailed to the wall for some sort of wrongdoing. i hope you get a nice fine, in the 5 figure range.

wtf is wrong with you? 

I HOPE YOU CUT YOURSELF ON A PARING KNIFE TODAY!!!!!



anyway, even if the Ethics Commission decides this is a violation of the code, there probably won't be a fine levied against these websites.  the result will likely be new codes related to websites. 

[lock+load]

wtf is wrong with you? 

The Geritol is wearing off.

[KCMax]

The blogosphere has been up in arms on this ambiguity and threats by the FCC to regulate political blogs for months now. Its created an unholy alliance between far lefters like dailykos.com and far righters like National Review Online. My guess is there is little chance the FCC will be able to regulate blogs, and no way any ethic committee can regulate saveourowners. If I put up a $9 sign in my front yard I made myself that made a political opinion, does that need to be reported?

But that's my opinion. Either way, I certainly wish no harm for our rich advocates. Chef, why don't you just tell Steve Glorioso who it is anyway? You said you knew who was behind it.

[kcdcchef]

Are you that bitter of an asshole?  I understand disagreeing with someones opinion but to wish them financial attack at the hands of big business?  You're that petty?  There are so many worthwhile issues and problems to put your energy to.  Find one and attack it instead of the operator of a parody website.  That's just banging your head against the wall.

i did not call you any names, do not call me any. and i wish nothing but harm for them, they are nameless, faceless cowards. at least kietz and pestro have the balls to campaign with their names. these dildos go on the air with fake names. be a man about it.

wtf is wrong with you?

I HOPE YOU CUT YOURSELF ON A PARING KNIFE TODAY!!!!!


anyway, even if the Ethics Commission decides this is a violation of the code, there probably won't be a fine levied against these websites. the result will likely be new codes related to websites.

i cut myself, and burn myself, multiple times weekly. goes with the territory. but with regards to these asswipes, i just wish they would be adults about it and quit hiding behind psuedonames. it is sad. a couple of young chickenshits, with extra time, a pc, and nowhere near the brains, courage, skill, or business know how, that glass and hunt have, taking cheap shots at them all day.

again, at least kietz, pestro, and those morons do it with their own names.