chingon wrote:
That's right, kids: Prairie Village might seem cool at first, but it is a gateway drug.
That's an awesome take on the situation.
Until recently my wife and I were thinking hard about making the move from Volker to NE Johnson County but, lucky for us, my oldest boy won the lottery at Academie Lafayette so we’ll be staying in the area. A lot of my friends who want to stay in urban KCMO suck it up and send their kids to private school. That’s reasonable if you just have 1 kid but 2 or more gets pricy fast. I’ve got 3.
Westwood View Elementary is probably the best elementary school in Johnson County. It’s no wonder houses cost what they do in Westwood Hills. Had we made the move JC, we likely would have made Roeland Park our home and sent the kids to Westwood View via the mom bus. Now we’re looking at moving to Hyde Park to be closer to both Academie Lafayette campuses.
I used to condemn people in my mind for moving to the burbs. I think I understand their plight better now though I still don’t think I will ever do it.
warwickland wrote:Is PV one of the "cooler" burbs in the KC area? I just say that because I had a professor who was fairly worldly, or whatever, who lived there, and you can actually walk home from Waldo/easy bike if you wanted (although they could improve that damn sidewalk on 75th and actually put a treelawn between it and the street!). I used to wander around over to PV and some other inner JoCo spots a bit. It seems almost comfortably enough connected to what I think of as "Kansas City," but some of those inner JoCo areas strangely don't have sidewalks off the main streets.
In my experience, with 30-something urban middle class parents whose kids are becoming school age and are looking for their first house "with schools", Prairie Village is the #1 destination, maybe Fairway second (due to price). The Westwoods seem to still be older with less turnover, there's also just less housing stock. Ditto N. Leawood.
I also think alot of those PV parent get a taste of the suburbs, wrap their minds and formerly citycentric egos around being suburbanites, decide to go big and eventually take the plunge into S. OP.
That's right, kids: Prairie Village might seem cool at first, but it is a gateway drug.
Yep, we've lost a few neighbors to south JoCo. They are so apologetic about it too - "we don't want to do it but you can get so much more house!"
KCMax wrote:
Yep, we've lost a few neighbors to south JoCo. They are so apologetic about it too - "we don't want to do it but you can get so much more house!"
Yeah, that's always strange. A woman recently told me "we can't even afford to furnish all the rooms."
My other favorite is the sheepish "we looked closer in, but we just couldn't afford NOT to".
I have worked in Westport for 17 years at a design office and we tend to have employees that are interested in urban or off-beat living rather than the typical suburban shlub. I have seen wave after wave of these design professionals over the years.
Most follow the same exact trend:
1. Graduate college and live in a funky and affordable Midtown apartment.
2. Get married and buy a Hyde Park/Volker/Brookside/or similar house. Get a dog.
3. Have a kid.
4. Have more kids. More kids means more space is needed. And as the oldest kid gets close to kindergarten age, time to school shop.
5. Move to NE JoCo for a slightly bigger house and/or better schools.
6. Live there 5 years then buy a bigger house. They want to stay in NEJoCo, but 4 bed, 2 or 3 car houses are few and too expensive. They have to buy that bigger house in south JoCo.
It happens over and over. It takes real dedication for urban KC living or a big love for NE JoCo to not follow this trend.
The above is what I see designy types doing. My other non-design friends never made it to KCMO or NE JoCo.
Those non-designy types followed this trend:
1. Graduate college and rent an apartment in a suburban fringe complex.
2. Get married and buy a smallish newish house on the suburban fringe.
3. Have kids and buy a bigger new or newish house on the suburban fringe.
i get the "schools" argument and why it causes people to move to the burbs. the kcmo schools, by and large, are failing to adequately serve the students, and private school is really expensive, especially for more than one child. if one does not get into academie lafayette or another one of the few decent KCMO schools, it becomes a very difficult situation.
i just don't understand the mentality that one's actual desires are somehow trumped by some innate "need" for more square footage. like, "ugh, we wanted to stay in an older neighborhood, but we could get a 4K sq ft house at 167th and blackbob for the same price, so we just HAD to do it!"
assuming a commute into the city, you're giving a lot more up than you're gaining with a house way out in the sticks. why live in a soul-crushing environment and take on a 30-45 minute commute just for more space? you can get a 3 or 4-bed house in PV, Roeland Park, or old leawood for $200K, sometimes less. you can get really nice ones for $200-350K, the cost of most newer cookie cutter houses in south JoCO. that $ will not get you all that much more square footage in south JoCo (or lee's summit or platte county or wherever).
obviously, some folks purportedly like the treeless, cul-de-sac, access-road, strip-mall environments of outer suburbia. i'm talking about the people who claim to like the midtown/brookside/PV sort of vibe, but somehow are just "forced" to buy a house 20 miles from the city based on square footage.
i grew up in a 1,200 sq ft house, 3-bed, 1.5-bath. the lack of second full bath was an occasional hassle, but i wouldn't say i ever felt like we were "cramped" in that house. nearly all of my friends grew up in a similar sized house as well. sometimes my parents lament not buying a larger house in lee's summit they almost bought when my brother and i were little, but for what? they have no idea. "more space." they also own a 8-passenger SUV that my father drives by himself 99% of the time. what is this weird desire to have way more space (or stuff) than you actually use or need?
The world is constantly telling you that you need more stuff and more space to house that stuff. And you need to have enough space so no one has to actually be in the same room as another person at any given time.
It's hard for most people to resist it if everyone else is doing it.
chrizow wrote:i get the "schools" argument and why it causes people to move to the burbs. the kcmo schools, by and large, are failing to adequately serve the students, and private school is really expensive, especially for more than one child. if one does not get into academie lafayette or another one of the few decent KCMO schools, it becomes a very difficult situation.
i just don't understand the mentality that one's actual desires are somehow trumped by some innate "need" for more square footage. like, "ugh, we wanted to stay in an older neighborhood, but we could get a 4K sq ft house at 167th and blackbob for the same price, so we just HAD to do it!"
assuming a commute into the city, you're giving a lot more up than you're gaining with a house way out in the sticks. why live in a soul-crushing environment and take on a 30-45 minute commute just for more space? you can get a 3 or 4-bed house in PV, Roeland Park, or old leawood for $200K, sometimes less. you can get really nice ones for $200-350K, the cost of most newer cookie cutter houses in south JoCO. that $ will not get you all that much more square footage in south JoCo (or lee's summit or platte county or wherever).
obviously, some folks purportedly like the treeless, cul-de-sac, access-road, strip-mall environments of outer suburbia. i'm talking about the people who claim to like the midtown/brookside/PV sort of vibe, but somehow are just "forced" to buy a house 20 miles from the city based on square footage.
i grew up in a 1,200 sq ft house, 3-bed, 1.5-bath. the lack of second full bath was an occasional hassle, but i wouldn't say i ever felt like we were "cramped" in that house. nearly all of my friends grew up in a similar sized house as well. sometimes my parents lament not buying a larger house in lee's summit they almost bought when my brother and i were little, but for what? they have no idea. "more space." they also own a 8-passenger SUV that my father drives by himself 99% of the time. what is this weird desire to have way more space (or stuff) than you actually use or need?
What's even more baffling is all the empty-nesters that still live in these houses.
chaglang wrote:What's even more baffling is all the empty-nesters that still live in these houses.
It's probably still where their friends live. And, like most other people, they probably have too much crap in their house to easily downsize.
not only that, but it's not uncommon for empty nesters to build an even bigger, new house with even more space. "for the grandchildren" that come visit a few times per year.
chrizow wrote:you can get really nice ones for $200-350K, the cost of most newer cookie cutter houses in south JoCO. that $ will not get you all that much more square footage in south JoCo (or lee's summit or platte county or wherever).
I have personally helped some of these people try to stay in NE JoCo by finding homes for them to check out and encouraging them to stay closer to the city. They really wanted to, but dollar for dollar, you simply cannot find a comparable house east of Metcalf and north of I-435 for what can be had south or west. The intangibles like less travel, mature trees, closer to the plaza/PV shops/brookside are not things they bring into the equation. It’s all about the house size and function of the house for them. Anything outside the property line of their home is not taken into strong consideration. The “affordable” large homes you mention are still not comparable to a south JoCo home because they are not updated or are in a weird location.
They seem to be happy about the move as well. There are more “people like them” (white professionals with kids), so they find community in that. Though they recall their old KCMO/PV/Raytown/Mission life as a fond memory, they rarely long to return. The suburbs may be broken, but a vast majority of the population still prefers it.
slimwhitman wrote:Though they recall their old KCMO/PV/Raytown/Mission life as a fond memory, they rarely long to return.
A coworker of mine who lives at 159th talks about her time in Waldo as if it was a youthful indescretion akin to recreational drug use and threesomes. It was something wild and crazy she and her husband did when they first got married- until they they grew up, moved out south, and had kids.
The implications are interesting: one is that I'm irresponsible for choosing to raise my kid east of Troost. I haven't "grown up" and moved away in search of better schools. The other implication is that her life, by virtue of making "responsible" choices, is a hell of a lot more boring.
slimwhitman wrote:Though they recall their old KCMO/PV/Raytown/Mission life as a fond memory, they rarely long to return.
A coworker of mine who lives at 159th talks about her time in Waldo as if it was a youthful indescretion akin to recreational drug use and threesomes. It was something wild and crazy she and her husband did when they first got married- until they they grew up, moved out south, and had kids.
I rented apartments and houses on Plaza and Brookside for several years. moved downtown and rented a condo for several years. Recently purchased a house in Northeast PV.
For my fiancee and I it came down to money, housing market, and schools. Our ideal neighborhoods are Westwood Hills and Brookside, but WH is definately out of our price range at this time, and Brookside requires a private education - which we're not willing to invest in. To each their own. Personally, I'm not going to pass up a free education in KS when the schools are high quality. I love the character of Brookside homes, I love the neighborhoods and the proximate locations. But, we knew we'd have to move for a public education in 6-7 years and, considering the volatility in the real estate market, I didn't like that uncertainty. With PV, if the market is shit in 2020, I have the security of being able to stay put.
fortunately we have guaranteed access to academie lafayette for our (not yet extant) kids, so we can peacefully live in kcmo for at least the next 15 years.
That’s because, four years after the district began administering seven schools annexed from the Kansas City School District, the district’s western elementary schools will be operating near or at capacity. That largely will be unchanged even after the district opens a new elementary school in Sugar Creek a year from now.
chrizow wrote:fortunately we have guaranteed access to academie lafayette for our (not yet extant) kids, so we can peacefully live in kcmo for at least the next 15 years.
Nice! How'd you swing that?
We have one at Border Star for pre-k, which is our hedge in case we don't hit the AL lottery.
chrizow wrote:fortunately we have guaranteed access to academie lafayette for our (not yet extant) kids, so we can peacefully live in kcmo for at least the next 15 years.
Nice! How'd you swing that?
kids of AL faculty have an automatic "in." my wife works there.
interestingly, a lot of AL faculty members choose not to send their kids there - typically the international faculty (AL has lots of teachers from france, belgium, africa, etc.). their kids already speak french, but they need to learn english! so they live in the burbs or use private school.
