P&L District: 14th & Main Site Proposal

[Long]

Confess: have you ever torn up shag carpet?

If you have, then you're thumbing your nose at older tastes.  Have you re-done odd wallpaper or light fixtures?  B/c if they are functional, and you removed it anyway.....

First, that analogy is absurd.  Second, I've addressed more than once the idea of tearing down a building just because it has fallen out of style. 

[Maitre D]

First, that analogy is absurd. 

First, Gladstoner had the same thought:  "The exact same thought crossed my mind."

Second, I've addressed more than once the idea of tearing down a building just because it has fallen out of style. 

I'm asking you a direct question.  Will you answer it?  Just tell us if you're ever torn up anything that, while still functional, was ugly or out of place.  Just give us your personal answer, and we'll compare it vs. your words in this thread.

[kcdcchef]

i think the case here is that a lot of stuff will go in there, along this area, that will add. at 12th and main, an 18 story tower, at 13th and main, the same. so what if the replacement along 14th is like zona rosa, who gives a shit, at least it will be used.

[Long]

First, Gladstoner had the same thought:  "The exact same thought crossed my mind."

I'm asking you a direct question.  Will you answer it?  Just tell us if you're ever torn up anything that, while still functional, was ugly or out of place.   Just give us your personal answer, and we'll compare it vs. your words in this thread.

Anything functional, just ugly or out of place. . .  can't think of any.  I never owned shag carpeting.  I have replaced old worn carpeting from the 80s, but it wasn't shag.  And it was old and worn.  It was no longer functional.  Replaced some old windows. . . but those were old and inefficient.  They didn't seal out the winter air, and they didn't stay open very well. 

I replaced my old car, which wasn't very pretty, and it still ran well. . . except it was totalled in the crash.  Not feasible to repair.

Again, your analogy is absurd.  Buildings are part of the public realm, they form the public space.  Even privately owned homes.  Buildings represent something bigger than flooring.  And you always have to weigh the feasibility of keeping an old building versus replacing it-- not every single building is worth saving, some are simply in such a state of disrepair, or some are designed in such a way that there just isn't a reuse for them.  But some are structurally sound, completely useful, and maybe a little ugly to some people.  And AGAIN, in the 50s, buildings from 1900 were considered to be "ugly and out of place."  So it was ok to tear those down?   Too bad urban renewal didn't take them all out, because if they were all gone, out of sight out of mind, nobody would ever know what they lost.

[Long]

I would actually apply the "shag carpeting" analogy to the idea of renovating an existing building-- if I don't like the shag carpeting, I don't tear down the whole house.  I replace the carpeting.

If the state office building needs more windows, get a good architect to figure out how to put some more windows into it.  If the tile on the floor of the lobby is cheap and tacky, replace it.  If the exterior concrete is that ugly, paint it.  I'm not preaching a platform of strict preservation-- my opinion is that modern buildings are meant to be visually an expression of their function, so I think that allows you to modify the appearance in order to reflect a change in its function.  Older buildings were designed to present a certain "look" or "image" to the street-- the windows might have followed a strict pattern or order that had nothing to do with what was happening inside. . . ornament was applied to old garment factories just as it was applied to office buildings.  There is an argument to be made for not changing a building from 1900 that I don't think applies to modern buildings-- the theory behind the design of a modern building, in my opinion, allows for it to be modified to reflect a change in its function.

[kcdcchef]

but what if the architect said it was more cost effective to build a new building versus adding more windows to a 3 story landfill?

[Long]

but what if the architect said it was more cost effective to build a new building versus adding more windows to a 3 story landfill?

Which architect?

Everyone has their own agenda.  I could find you an architect that would keep it exactly as it is, one that would propose something wrapped entirely in stainless steel, and one that would build a replica of a Virginia courthouse circa 1798, and all of them would tell you it is the "right thing to do."

[kcdcchef]

the architect was a hypothetical thing.

finding differing architecture opinions is as easy as finding a crooked shrink for a murder trial

[KCN]

Anyone know when actual demolition is slated to start?  Looks like the move out of this building is complete as no one is parking here anymore.

Can't wait for every block of this district to be undergoing actual construction. 

[kcdcchef]

so i take it this is the last block awaiting action?

[KCN]

Depends on the res tower and retail planned next to the P&L building.  That's still part of the district as far as I know.

[kcdcchef]

well i say LETS GET IT ON

[Long]

I can't wait for JUST ONE block of the district to start seeing actual construction (besides H&R). . . I keep thinking the 13th and Walnut block has to start sometime soon, but every time I go buy they are still digging the hole out deeper. . .  I was saying to myself "that's a big hole" 2 months ago. . .

[kcdcchef]

they are just digging holes to scrap the p&l in favor of the great lakes south

[scooterj]

Abatement work has started on the former government building.  (The telltale plastic sleeves are hanging out some of the upper windows.)

[scooterj]

From the Star on 9/13:

The State Office Building at 1411 Main St. is scheduled to be demolished by the end of November, according to Mike McClure of the Capital Improvements Management Office. The Kansas City Chapter of the American Institute of Architects had hoped to save the building, which is listed in its guide to local architecture, but at this point it still has a date with the wrecking ball.

[scooterj]

Some excavation has started on this block, revealing a brick-paved alley and a long-buried basement wall.

[Gladstoner]

Did they recently knock out all of the windows on the top floor of the Mo. building or did they just clean them really good?

[Long]

Did they recently knock out all of the windows on the top floor of the Mo. building or did they just clean them really good?

Top floor windows are gone.

[staubio]

Damn it.

This building might look ugly in most people's opinion, but if you go down there and stand on the street and see how it interacts with everything that is and will be there, the variety is excellent and it looks great.  This is such a stupid waste of a building that is a showcase for some architectural aficionados.  I'll be really pissed if the Cordish stuff comes out looking like the City Place Apartments in Westport.