Downtown Baseball Stadium

[smh]

I'm just talking the grand side. Again just one of many reasons this is a bad location, not the biggest reason

Don't get me wrong, I remain skeptical largely because KC is never very good at the details and for many of the reasons you've mentioned, but I am also open to hearing more.

[Imarealperson]

I'm just talking the grand side. Again just one of many reasons this is a bad location, not the biggest reason

So 1/4 of the block. Got it. It’s basically 77th and Wornall over there. It’s not 5th Ave.

[Imarealperson]

Another thought, would this be a boon to the streetcar TDD? I’m unsure exactly how that works.

[DColeKC]

We will never learn. Completely empty lot ready for a building only active 81 days a year and doesn't create development around it (based on posts here) and we instead drop this in our growing downtown neighborhood.

I stare at this area daily and I haven't seen my much growth, I have witnessed businesses come and go but I don't consider that growth. I see more stagnation than anything.That's just my opinion and I have no data to back that up.

I don't get this concept of stadiums not creating development. I certainly think that's been the case in some cities where stadiums are built in the middle of nothing and the expectation is people will want to build around it. You know, like Truman Sports Complex, but in this case, by building the stadium in close proximity to highly desirable and emerging developments, it is much more likely to help speed that up while also bringing a great deal of attention to our downtown on a national level, which is important.

[DColeKC]

EC ball park would have spectacular views of the AT&T building.

No question which one would have better views.
East Village - Official renderings had a southern facing orientation.



Assuming a north orientation similar to Cleveland.



We all complain about surface parking lots. Assuming we see this proposed in the area bound by Grand and Locust, you're looking at a total area of 17 acres. 4 of those acres are currently surface parking lots. Over 5 acres is the existing star press building site, leaving 8 acres of land with existing buildings.

[TheUrbanRoo]

I’m sure they can do something to fix up that At&T building as well if need be.

[GRID]

I'm just talking the grand side. Again just one of many reasons this is a bad location, not the biggest reason

So 1/4 of the block. Got it. It’s basically 77th and Wornall over there. It’s not 5th Ave.

Yeah, this whole movement of a stadium destroying the crossroads is nuts.

First off this is a small part of the entire crossroads, but mostly, that area is just not well developed at all. I mean I don't get the love for the area. I hate tearing things down, but geez. That area is not really urban, it's half parking lots and very few of the buildings are worth getting worked up over.

They are all 1-2 story buildings and nearly all of them have a surface parking lots associated with them. The only sizable building is a U-haul storage center where parking for moving trucks takes up half the block.

The little strip of buildings on the east side of Grand?

The bar and parking lot on the corner can go for sure. Then what is left is the few buildings to the south. I mean they are sort of old by midwestern standards, but the crossroads is full of buildings like that and I'm not sure they are worth holding up what may be a game changer project for downtown KC.

Still waiting on what the Royals come up with and exactly where the stadium would go and what might have to be torn down.

[moderne]

I don't get it. The last idea the owners of the Star Press were pitching was to have the ball park east of Oak and turn the press bldng into a giant game arcade. If they are no longer pushing for the ball park on their site, why?

[GRID]

And what in the hell is this?

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0939168 ... ?entry=ttu

Was there no way to stop that from being built? 3/4 of the block is a parking lot. It's a waist to tear down a new structure, but it should have never been built in the first place. Not in that location.

[beautyfromashes]

First off this is a small part of the entire crossroads, but mostly, that area is just not well developed at all. I mean I don't get the love for the area. I hate tearing things down, but geez. That area is not really urban, it's half parking lots and very few of the buildings are worth getting worked up over.

You've been around enough you should know that this isn't just about the development lines and where the actual stadium would go. The Belfrey? gone. Retro Inferno? gone. McGee Shops? gone. Record Bar. Messenger Coffee. Green Dirt. And what's left? Sitting outside at Tannin you will have the view of a giant parking garage on the corner. It probably will be turned into a sports bar anyway. That's not counting what will happen to the rest of the Crossroads. Grinder's concert lot will be too expensive not to sell. Many single story buildings will be torn down. I don't see the progress, especially when all of this has a place ready for it.

[GRID]

Most of the things you listed are west of Grand. Why would they go away for this project? If any parking is built, it would likely be to the east of the stadium replacing parking lots and industrial buildings if the planners know what they are doing. There is no reason for parking to the west. And other than maybe one garage for those that have to be super close to the stadium, I don't see the need for additional parking.

If you are worried about the land becoming too valuable for those businesses west of Grand to stay, well that's going to happen regardless. If KC builds the park over 670, I would think you would want something better bordering it than Retro Inferno. Nothing wrong with them, but they can be anywhere in the crossroads. That building is not going to be ideal in that location much longer regardless if the stadium goes there.

If you don't allow this area to develop into a more dense urban area, then what is the point of the 670 park?

[DColeKC]

I don't get it. The last idea the owners of the Star Press were pitching was to have the ball park east of Oak and turn the press bldng into a giant game arcade. If they are no longer pushing for the ball park on their site, why?

The owners of the Star Press building have zero do with the actual plans. They of course want to sell it, they made a terrible investment and they know a baseball stadium is about the only realistic option. There is no saving that building. Now why they can't stay out of the press, I have no clue.

[DColeKC]

I’m sure they can do something to fix up that At&T building as well if need be.

For sure, rare but long lines buildings have been flipped. I'd expect them to build a new high-rise to block that view regardless.

[TheBigChuckbowski]

Most of the things you listed are west of Grand. Why would they go away for this project? If any parking is built, it would likely be to the east of the stadium replacing parking lots and industrial buildings if the planners know what they are doing. There is no reason for parking to the west. And other than maybe one garage for those that have to be super close to the stadium, I don't see the need for additional parking.

How is that you think the East Crossroads will be totally fine with the EC site but West Paseo would be leveled for parking for the EV site?

[Rusty Irish]

Two other small market MLB teams in urban locations with little in the way of on site parking, Cleveland and San Diego's stadiums are a footprint of 12 acres. I'd guess at a minimum for the stadium then you're talking the demolition of the star building (4.7 acres) and then everything as previously suggested between Oak and Cherry and Truman and 17th simply just to build the park.

Hard to see where any room for a "ballpark district" is. Maybe it's Cordish selling further expansion at P&L somehow. Maybe the Royals don't have the cash or don't want to spend it either and Cordish is their "partner".

[GRID]

Most of the things you listed are west of Grand. Why would they go away for this project? If any parking is built, it would likely be to the east of the stadium replacing parking lots and industrial buildings if the planners know what they are doing. There is no reason for parking to the west. And other than maybe one garage for those that have to be super close to the stadium, I don't see the need for additional parking.

How is that you think the East Crossroads will be totally fine with the EC site but West Paseo would be leveled for parking for the EV site?

Location. The east loop is a MAJOR barrier. The east loop is not only not going to go away or be capped, but it needs to be widened quite a bit to be brought up to modern interstate standards. If will never be tunneled, which is the only way to fix it. I mean not in the next 70 years.

Paseo West is an island once again surrounded by highways, is mostly industrial etc and it has a lot of urban social issues that like it or not are a problem. (homeless, crime etc). It's disconnected from the downtown, crossroads, river market etc despite it's proximity. However it will be perfect for parking for a stadium in EV.

The crossroads location is totally different. Especially after the 670 park is built. The stadium will be on the DIRECT edge of the urban fabric of the core of both the crossroads and the CBD. There will be plenty of parking in those areas, but any additional parking can be built to the east up against the highways with no harm done.

I also think the EV will be quickly developed with five over ones if the stadium goes to the CR. I think it could develop into something similar to the west side of downtown.

[brooksidebadgers]

Royals owners and partners have the cash. I just don't understand why the original EV plan has been scrapped with no explanation why?

[beautyfromashes]

Most of the things you listed are west of Grand. Why would they go away for this project?

Because everything within a 5 block radius will be dedicated to that park. Hotels, parking garages, empty lots, sports bars…
There will be no place for any one story buildings (except PNL) because when you can tear down your building and make $1000s for 81+ games and additional events, that makes many uses obsolete. So, it will be a district of Hampton Inns, Residence Inns, vanilla sports bars and giant garages. This is why it should be in EV. There’s room for those things there. You’re not wrecking anything else. Create a 21st century area all you want. The pushing out of businesses for cookie cutter development will be pervasive.

[grovester]

First off this is a small part of the entire crossroads, but mostly, that area is just not well developed at all. I mean I don't get the love for the area. I hate tearing things down, but geez. That area is not really urban, it's half parking lots and very few of the buildings are worth getting worked up over.

You've been around enough you should know that this isn't just about the development lines and where the actual stadium would go. The Belfrey? gone. Retro Inferno? gone. McGee Shops? gone. Record Bar. Messenger Coffee. Green Dirt. And what's left? Sitting outside at Tannin you will have the view of a giant parking garage on the corner. It probably will be turned into a sports bar anyway. That's not counting what will happen to the rest of the Crossroads. Grinder's concert lot will be too expensive not to sell. Many single story buildings will be torn down. I don't see the progress, especially when all of this has a place ready for it.

This is the truth.

[GRID]

Two other small market MLB teams in urban locations with little in the way of on site parking, Cleveland and San Diego's stadiums are a footprint of 12 acres. I'd guess at a minimum for the stadium then you're talking the demolition of the star building (4.7 acres) and then everything as previously suggested between Oak and Cherry and Truman and 17th simply just to build the park.

Hard to see where any room for a "ballpark district" is. Maybe it's Cordish selling further expansion at P&L somehow. Maybe the Royals don't have the cash or don't want to spend it either and Cordish is their "partner".

I think this "ballpark district" will be nothing more than the Royals hope to build something like Ballpark Village in St Louis. A small baseball stadium oriented retail building. And the Royals hope to develop some towers as well. But that's not happening unless they partner with a major developer.

So basically, they are not going to build this "district" everybody is envisioning. Downtown KC can't support another P&L District. I can see the Royals building the stadium, maybe a parking garage or two to the east that are shared with apartment towers and a very small building to house a few bars and restaurants somewhere.