Downtown Baseball Stadium

[GRID]

If either team moves to Kansas, I'm done with KC. I will never give two shits about the city again. Mark this post...

[shinatoo]

I've done a 180 on this. Kansas can have them for 25 years. Let them carry the water for a change. They will move back and the cycle continues.

[mean]

I've done a 180 on this. Kansas can have them for 25 years. Let them carry the water for a change. They will move back and the cycle continues.

Amen.

[TheUrbanRoo]

If either team moves to Kansas, I'm done with KC. I will never give two shits about the city again. Mark this post...

Chiefs I could live with, but if the Royals did? Then yeah, it's wayyyy over.

[KCPowercat]

So dramatic. Royals ownership isn't stupid they know the value of an urban baseball stadium, settle down.

[Highlander]

If either team moves to Kansas, I'm done with KC. I will never give two shits about the city again. Mark this post...

Chiefs I could live with, but if the Royals did? Then yeah, it's wayyyy over.

I could really care less what state the Royals or the Chiefs play in. The Royals are at a crappy suburban location presently and moving to Kansas would not change that; in fact, it would probably at least be a better suburban location. But the Kansas/Missouri thing means nothing to me. The only issue for me is downtown vs suburban location. Anything short of a downtown location would be a fail.

This is an opportunity a city gets once every 40-60 years and the thought of further entrenching the baseball venue in the suburbs is ridiculously stupid (do people ever think about what's best overall for the city and for future generations?). I'll also never understand how our metro gets into a predicament where this decision (among others critical infrastructure decisions) becomes the will of a single county with a minority of the metro's population. It would be great if the Royals could work with all metro counties to come up with funding for a downtown stadium and then offer a ticket discount for participating counties (like the zoo does).

[TheUrbanRoo]

For the record I think it's like a 1% chance they would go to the Kansas suburbs

[moderne]

It may take brinkmanship to put Baseball downtown. When the JAX Co vote fails would the metro counties act together to keep MLB in KC?

[alejandro46]

If either team moves to Kansas, I'm done with KC. I will never give two shits about the city again. Mark this post...

Chiefs I could live with, but if the Royals did? Then yeah, it's wayyyy over.

I could really care less what state the Royals or the Chiefs play in. The Royals are at a crappy suburban location presently and moving to Kansas would not change that; in fact, it would probably at least be a better suburban location. But the Kansas/Missouri thing means nothing to me. The only issue for me is downtown vs suburban location. Anything short of a downtown location would be a fail.

This is an opportunity a city gets once every 40-60 years and the thought of further entrenching the baseball venue in the suburbs is ridiculously stupid (do people ever think about what's best overall for the city and for future generations?). I'll also never understand how our metro gets into a predicament where this decision (among others critical infrastructure decisions) becomes the will of a single county with a minority of the metro's population. It would be great if the Royals could work with all metro counties to come up with funding for a downtown stadium and then offer a ticket discount for participating counties (like the zoo does).

Last time a bi-state measure was passed was 1996 - Union Station right? KC Zoo is Clay-Jackson County. Unfortunately we KC is held back by our bi-state nature.

[GRID]

If either team moves to Kansas, I'm done with KC. I will never give two shits about the city again. Mark this post...

Chiefs I could live with, but if the Royals did? Then yeah, it's wayyyy over.

For me it's Chiefs too.

KCMO has been totally ravaged by Kansas over the past several decades and seeing the MLS team play over there is bad enough.

The Chiefs need to either stay where they are or build a new stadium closer to downtown but on the MO side in NKC, Paseo West, West Bottoms etc. Hopefully they stay where they are because good lord that area looks like total shit today. I can't even imagine that area if the stadium left. It would just be replaced with warehouses and the surrounding area would deteriorate even faster than it already is.

The Royals absolutely need to move though and the ONLY place for them is downtown. NKC would be the last resort to keep them in KC.

The people that want to keep Kauffman are just nuts. It's not that nice of a stadium and the area it's in is literally embarrassing. Do these people that love the sports complex ever travel? I mean seriously do they ever freaking travel? If they did, they would be embarrassed to bring visitors anywhere near the stadium complex without constantly apologizing for the state that part of town is in.

And while I'm fine with the Royals going to EV, after driving around the area and giving several relatives tours of both sites, the best location is by far the Star press location. I am the last person that would ever be for tearing things down, I have been an extreme advocate of not tearing down active buildings in KC. But you really are not losing much in that area at all. A few nice business for sure, that hopefully could replicate what they have done nearby. Are they worth holding back a development that would likely change the direction of downtown KC for at least a generation? No way.

Everybody I showed both sites LOVED the star site and pretty much were meh or even hated the EV site. I know this is going to go against a lot of people here, but that's my opinion. The EV site is just too landlocked by highways and gov buildings. And I don't think it will ever develop the way people think it will. Let it develop into a residential area of 5 over ones. That's likely all that will ever go up over there.

Having a stadium that is tied to the P&L District, 670 park, and is much more tied to the Crossroads, Crown Center, Union Station and Jazz District just makes more sense. But again if EV is all KC can pull off then so be it. I will embrace EV.

And while I don't think there is much of a chance of the Royals going to Kanas, I honestly do think there is a chance they leave metro KC. It might take ten years, but they will be worth SO MUCH MORE in a larger faster growing metro with a modern stadium and Sherman is not going to be around forever. If KC drags its feet with this stadium issue, the team will move. And while they are in KC and everybody is loving Kauffman Stadium, they will be THE team the entire country will be fighting over to get them to relocate now that the Rays and A's are settled. Without a new stadium in the next several years, the Royals will be the number one candidate for relocation by far. Maybe that will help them get a stadium done though, who knows.

But extreme or not, if either team moves to Kansas, I will have to re-brand my man cave and just embrace the local teams here more. It would be the final nail in the coffin for me and no more thinking about what KC could have been, not that anybody cares what I think lol.

[Highlander]

If either team moves to Kansas, I'm done with KC. I will never give two shits about the city again. Mark this post...

Chiefs I could live with, but if the Royals did? Then yeah, it's wayyyy over.

The people that want to keep Kauffman are just nuts. It's not that nice of a stadium and the area it's in is literally embarrassing. Do these people that love the sports complex ever travel? I mean seriously do they ever freaking travel? If they did, they would be embarrassed to bring visitors anywhere near the stadium complex without constantly apologizing for the state that part of town is in.

And while I don't think there is much of a chance of the Royals gong to Kanas, I honestly do think there is a chance they leave metro KC. It might take ten years, but they will be worth SO MUCH MORE in a larger faster growing metro with a modern stadium and Sherman is not going to be around forever. If KC drags its feet with this stadium issue, the team will move. And while they are in KC and everybody is loving Kauffman Stadium, they will be THE team the entire country will be fighting over to get them to relocate now that the Rays and A's are settled. Without a new stadium in the next several years, the Royals will be the number one candidate for relocation by far. Maybe that will help them get a stadium done though, who knows.

But extreme or not, if either team moves to Kansas, I will have to re-band my mancave and just embrace the local teams here more. It would be the final nail in the coffin for me and no more thinking about what KC could have been, not that anybody cares what I think lol.

Well the elephant in the room is that Jackson County voters just are not going to approve a tax for a new stadium. Not now. Probably not ever. Unfortunately, this is not a simple re-education program like the airport. The problem is, once you get outside of KC west of the Blue River, the average Jackson Countian is just adverse to anything in the city other than an occasional trip to the zoo with the kids (or if you read their posts on social media, a nightmarish trip to the TMobile center for a music event braving horrific parking, traffic and crime). It's a suburban vs urban line in the sand voters have drawn and they are willing to place some pretty high stakes on it. Hence is the nature of the KC metro.

I wish it was otherwise but a Jackson County vote is a worst case demographic for the Royals. If they want public support, they must endeavor to make this a non-Jackson County only vote. You may disagree, but I think Johnson County voters would be far more receptive to a downtown stadium than suburban Jackson County voters. The contiguous nature of their community with urban KC makes them more vested in the outcome than the people who live in somewhat disconnected outlying communities like Blue Springs, Lees Summit and Raymore. At the very least, the Royals should push to have this a Kansas City only vote in Platte, Clay and Jackson Counties. Of course, that would require a new tax rather than the continuation of an already in place tax. The only way this ever passes in Jackson County is under threat of a move to Kansas or outside the metro (and I consider the latter not only possible but likely if the Royals don't get out of TSC) and even then, I think it would be a close vote and it still may fail.

[KCPowercat]

If either team moves to Kansas, I'm done with KC. I will never give two shits about the city again. Mark this post...

Chiefs I could live with, but if the Royals did? Then yeah, it's wayyyy over.

For me it's Chiefs too.

KCMO has been totally ravaged by Kansas over the past several decades and seeing the MLS team play over there is bad enough.

The Chiefs need to either stay where they are or build a new stadium closer to downtown but on the MO side in NKC, Paseo West, West Bottoms etc. Hopefully they stay where they are because good lord that area looks like total shit today. I can't even imagine that area if the stadium left. It would just be replaced with warehouses and the surrounding area would deteriorate even faster than it already is.

The Royals absolutely need to move though and the ONLY place for them is downtown. NKC would be the last resort to keep them in KC.

The people that want to keep Kauffman are just nuts. It's not that nice of a stadium and the area it's in is literally embarrassing. Do these people that love the sports complex ever travel? I mean seriously do they ever freaking travel? If they did, they would be embarrassed to bring visitors anywhere near the stadium complex without constantly apologizing for the state that part of town is in.

And while I'm fine with the Royals going to EV, after driving around the area and giving several relatives tours of both sites, the best location is by far the Star press location. I am the last person that would ever be for tearing things down, I have been an extreme advocate of not tearing down active buildings in KC. But you really are not losing much in that area at all. A few nice business for sure, that hopefully could replicate what they have done nearby. Are they worth holding back a development that would likely change the direction of downtown KC for at least a generation? No way.

Everybody I showed both sites LOVED the star site and pretty much were meh or even hated the EV site. I know this is going to go against a lot of people here, but that's my opinion. The EV site is just too landlocked by highways and gov buildings. And I don't think it will ever develop the way people think it will. Let it develop into a residential area of 5 over ones. That's likely all that will ever go up over there.

Having a stadium that is tied to the P&L District, 670 park, and is much more tied to the Crossroads, Crown Center, Union Station and Jazz District just makes more sense. But again if EV is all KC can pull off then so be it. I will embrace EV.

And while I don't think there is much of a chance of the Royals going to Kanas, I honestly do think there is a chance they leave metro KC. It might take ten years, but they will be worth SO MUCH MORE in a larger faster growing metro with a modern stadium and Sherman is not going to be around forever. If KC drags its feet with this stadium issue, the team will move. And while they are in KC and everybody is loving Kauffman Stadium, they will be THE team the entire country will be fighting over to get them to relocate now that the Rays and A's are settled. Without a new stadium in the next several years, the Royals will be the number one candidate for relocation by far. Maybe that will help them get a stadium done though, who knows.

But extreme or not, if either team moves to Kansas, I will have to re-brand my man cave and just embrace the local teams here more. It would be the final nail in the coffin for me and no more thinking about what KC could have been, not that anybody cares what I think lol.

I mean there is zero doubt you show someone the two sites now which they would choose. It's because one is built up and active already. Tearing that down is insanity IMO.

[GRID]

There may be more support in JoCo, but I'm not sure it's that much more. I don't even think it would pass in most of central KCMO right now. I know none of my relatives in places like Hyde Park, Brookside etc support the idea. I doubt the east side would support it.

It does need a regional multi county tax, but that's not going to happen. Not even on the MO side alone. I mean it took years and years of negotiating etc to even get the counties to do the Union Station tax. If that were even an option for the stadiums, area counties would be years deep into the idea and it's not even on their radar today.

And there is zero chance of the Royals going to Kansas, the Chiefs maybe, but not the Royals. The KS side of the city is just not big enough to go at it alone and support the Royals and build them a proper stadium, especially after pissing off half their fan base. MLB needs a major market and the entire metro KC area is already on the small side for MLB today. When KC got the A's it was like the 18th largest metro. Now it's like the 31st largest.

I hope they can get a stadium done in KC, but right now, I think there is about a 50% chance the Royals are not in KC in 2035. In another ten years, places like Nashville and Charlotte will be too much larger and will build a downtown stadium for the Royals in a heartbeat.

And KC will be Buffalo when it comes to pro sports. I really wish people would think about how important the Royals are to the city.

[GRID]

I mean there is zero doubt you show someone the two sites now which they would choose. It's because one is built up and active already. Tearing that down is insanity IMO.

Personally, I'm not impressed with what's there now. Maybe three buildings with businesses that would be a loss. There is little there now that makes you go "wow, this is thriving urban area". It's still mostly parking lots, the star building, churches, storage etc. The few buildings that are active are nothing remarkable, just 1-2 story buildings in various states of upkeep.

You have to imagine what both sites would be like.

[GRID]

This corner is really the one of the only interesting buildings that has good uses and the building looks like it deserves to be in the heart of the city. It would really compliment a stadium since I'm sure it would stay.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0916305 ... ?entry=ttu

I would imagine all this would stay too and be enhanced.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0924801 ... ?entry=ttu

But what are you really losing near the actual stadium site?
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0943936 ... ?entry=ttu

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.094439, ... ?entry=ttu

I mean really, I know it's a bar, but come on.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0956982 ... ?entry=ttu

There is already nothing left in this area. Just a few buildings that I would not really get too worked up over.
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0955887 ... ?entry=ttu

[KCPowercat]

We've made this mistake decade after decade and bemoan our ancestors for doing it yet here we are wanting to commit the same crimes. I don't get it. I really don't. I'm not going to get into nit picking what business is what right now because that's a short term mindset that really doesn't matter to this conversation.

Tear down the Star and extend the 670 park cap south. You'll be amazed how what is remaining empty would fill up. Exactly like the blocks between P&L and EV once a stadium is there.

[smh]

I'd like to see a way to preserve the length of buildings facing Grand from Truman to 16th, starting south of the drycleaner/Prime building. We have so few contiguous blocks of small buildings like that. Hate to lose it, but I feel like there is a way to maintain it and incorporate it.

[KCPowercat]

I'd like to see a way to preserve the length of buildings facing Grand from Truman to 16th, starting south of the drycleaner/Prime building. We have so few contiguous blocks of small buildings like that. Hate to lose it, but I feel like there is a way to maintain it and incorporate it.

This stretch is an absolute non-starter and isn't really part of the discussion. Almost every "design" goes more east and the buildings/business east crossroads are the ones I'm worried about (along with closing Oak for yet another superblock.

[smh]

I'd like to see a way to preserve the length of buildings facing Grand from Truman to 16th, starting south of the drycleaner/Prime building. We have so few contiguous blocks of small buildings like that. Hate to lose it, but I feel like there is a way to maintain it and incorporate it.

This stretch is an absolute non-starter and isn't really part of the discussion. Almost every "design" goes more east and the buildings/business east crossroads are the ones I'm worried about (along with closing Oak for yet another superblock.

It would be very foolish to close Oak. I don't really see that happening. Leaving, what, Main St as the only intact piece of the grid west of 71?

[Rusty Irish]

There may be more support in JoCo, but I'm not sure it's that much more. I don't even think it would pass in most of central KCMO right now. I know none of my relatives in places like Hyde Park, Brookside etc support the idea. I doubt the east side would support it.

It does need a regional multi county tax, but that's not going to happen. Not even on the MO side alone. I mean it took years and years of negotiating etc to even get the counties to do the Union Station tax. If that were even an option for the stadiums, area counties would be years deep into the idea and it's not even on their radar today.

And there is zero chance of the Royals going to Kansas, the Chiefs maybe, but not the Royals. The KS side of the city is just not big enough to go at it alone and support the Royals and build them a proper stadium, especially after pissing off half their fan base. MLB needs a major market and the entire metro KC area is already on the small side for MLB today. When KC got the A's it was like the 18th largest metro. Now it's like the 31st largest.

I hope they can get a stadium done in KC, but right now, I think there is about a 50% chance the Royals are not in KC in 2035. In another ten years, places like Nashville and Charlotte will be too much larger and will build a downtown stadium for the Royals in a heartbeat.

And KC will be Buffalo when it comes to pro sports. I really wish people would think about how important the Royals are to the city.

Completely agree.

Theres going to be some losers in the upcoming MLB expansion race and it looks like there could easily be 8-10 cities involved. Nashville, SLC, Montreal, Portland, San Antonio, Charlotte, Sacramento probably even Oakland will all be seriously in the hunt for this. If theres no new stadium the Royals are clearly going to be the backup option as the consolation.

I dread to think of a local sports lansdscape reduced to SKC being entrenched out at the Legends and the Chiefs likewise at TSC.