WoodDraw wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 2:00 pm
I agree that food and drinks will be interesting. There are so many known unknowns because of how outdated our airport was.
Having all the airlines together will allow services that previously couldn't survive. Even locals might get to the airport earlier now and grab food or a drink when before they wouldn't.
I normally fly Delta and they stopped opening the restaurant after covid and the bathroom was so small it couldn't handle people drinking and eating anyway. It made no sense to get to the terminal early. Even outside the terminal the restaurant was serving only cold sandwiches when it was open.
Its based on the ratios at other peer airports.
Yeah, I meant to say that too. The default reasoning should always be that the experts building it aren't idiots.
Just mean it'll be interesting to see it play out since it's so different from what we have now.
I just hope the airport is patient and allows time for KC people to adopt a more normal way of flying. This will be a total cultural change for the local flying public and it would really suck if places started closing before the airport got more flights and locals started using the new places.
Basically, it's now okay to get there a little early, or drop somebody off a little early. I know I will be using the restaurants at the new terminal because we almost always stop on Barry Road someplace to eat on the way an it's just stressful eating before you go to the airport. You are always on edge watching the clock. I prefer to get to the airport, get bags checked, get through security and then get something to eat within five minutes of my gate. It's just so much more relaxing.
I have said the same thing though. This is going from nothing to probably way more than a similar sized airport. However, it might just work simply because of the way the airport is set up with nearly everybody passing through common areas and the nodes only being a few minutes apart. I mean KC now has more places to eat than the Southwest concourses of BWI and I would imagine concourses A and B at BWI are about the same volume or maybe more than all of KCI.
I really like the new terminal. I have watched a ton of videos and I still think it seems a tad too small. I really think most of the main common areas should be about 20-30% more sq footage. The gate concourses look okay since there are not that many gates on each wing, but those two primary nodes of retail space just seem cramped to me. Still 1000 times better than the old terminals and maybe in real life, I won't fell like that. I would rather it feel busy and even somewhat cramped than the way the current terminals feel though. And even if the new KCI is cramped, there seems to be enough seating at the restaurants. That is a huge problem at many airports. Not enough sit down seating.
Sill hope they get the buses figured out too. All the other issues like no curb or departure/arrival level service can be overlooked as long as frequencies are no more than every ten minutes. They got to get the frequencies up. When I mentioned they will have the buses in the garage to my wife the first thing she said was, do the buses still come ever 20-30 or even 40 minutes. That's just too long.
I'm not sure KC is like a backwater of the world where people haven't been exposed to real airports. I know online commentators have brain worms, but the reception in the city seems super positive.
KC voted for this by 75%. I don't get why you think the city is resistant to this.
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 3:27 pm
I'm not sure KC is like a backwater of the world where people haven't been exposed to real airports. I know online commentators have brain worms, but the reception in the city seems super positive.
KC voted for this by 75%. I don't get why you think the city is resistant to this.
I think that's what gets you the most shit here.
Facebook and Twitter comments can be misleading to the public reception and attitude of the metro, but I’ve not talked to a single person offline who has any negative commentary. Everyone is stoked. This is 100% a situation where not living in the metro skews one’s perception of it.
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 3:27 pm
I'm not sure KC is like a backwater of the world where people haven't been exposed to real airports. I know online commentators have brain worms, but the reception in the city seems super positive.
KC voted for this by 75%. I don't get why you think the city is resistant to this.
I think that's what gets you the most shit here.
Facebook and Twitter comments can be misleading to the public reception and attitude of the metro, but I’ve not talked to a single person offline who has any negative commentary. Everyone is stoked. This is 100% a situation where not living in the metro skews one’s perception of it.
The number of ridiculous posts on Facebook and Twitter opposing any improvement in KC once kind of got me down but when I look at the profile of the people opposed to the new terminal, I usually see that they 1) don't live in the KC area 2) are MAGA/conspiracy theory types that generally thumb their noses at any project requiring government oversight or 3) haven't engaged in the subject matter for years. One of the typical protests to downtown ballpark other than typical parking/traffic hysteria is that KC had a downtown ballpark and moved it to the burbs because of parking issues. A myth on social media that gets repeated a lot presently is that the new terminal is well over budget. That myth was fomented by some very misleading reporting by KC media companies. I was very encouraged that every time I looked at a post from someone who attended the simulation or open house, they were extremely impressed by the new terminal. I think the large majority of the flying public will love the new airport.
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Sun Feb 19, 2023 3:27 pm
I'm not sure KC is like a backwater of the world where people haven't been exposed to real airports. I know online commentators have brain worms, but the reception in the city seems super positive.
KC voted for this by 75%. I don't get why you think the city is resistant to this.
I think that's what gets you the most shit here.
Facebook and Twitter comments can be misleading to the public reception and attitude of the metro, but I’ve not talked to a single person offline who has any negative commentary. Everyone is stoked. This is 100% a situation where not living in the metro skews one’s perception of it.
Grid knows KC well and he expresses a frustration a lot of people that have been involved in kc for a long time express, mostly depressed exasperation. He's earned the right.
But I think it looks good! Let's open it and find out. Absolute cynicism does no good for anyone.
I have not said anything that has not been said by others, but I'm a hater. When others say it, people interact and engage an even agree.
For the last time, the new terminal is awesome and long overdue. That doesn't mean there might be some things that could have and maybe still could be done better. The ground transportation thing is something that can be easily modified (if needed) with this new terminal for example but only if people ask for it and know it can be better.
And I never said anything about kc being backwater. The city is simply used to not having any amenities at the airport and it will probably take some time for people to actually make that more a part of their travel plans. And it will take time for kci to get more connecting flights to help sustain all the new amenities.
And have some cabs. Even if they are run by the airport itself. I'll bring up BWI again. They have their own cab system.
And finally my criticism on the smaller size of the airport sq footage, ceiling heights etc (which is very minor) is likely not a big deal. I think the main thing the new terminal has going for it is its compact size and the fact that all travelers have very easy access to all the amenities.
The new airport is super amazing overall and I can't wait to fly into it next month.
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 2:23 pm
Ha, I was defending you! think occasionally you're to cynical.
Push back and criticism is healthy though and I'll continue to defend it!
I get it. I know I can be overly critical, but just know this is where I come to be critical of KC because I feel like this is a good platform for that and most here simply want KC development at the highest level possible.
I have been nothing but supportive of the new terminal, even posting vidoes of it on my facebook page etc. Constantly defending on various social media platforms etc. But I'm excited for KC and this new terminal so I really hope people take my criticism as simply my ideas that can make it even better. This is especially true for the airport since I use KCI as a visitor now, not a local.
WoodDraw wrote: ↑Mon Feb 20, 2023 2:23 pm
Ha, I was defending you! think occasionally you're to cynical.
Push back and criticism is healthy though and I'll continue to defend it!
I get it. I know I can be overly critical, but just know this is where I come to be critical of KC because I feel like this is a good platform for that and most here simply want KC development at the highest level possible.
I have been nothing but supportive of the new terminal, even posting vidoes of it on my facebook page etc. Constantly defending on various social media platforms etc. But I'm excited for KC and this new terminal so I really hope people take my criticism as simply my ideas that can make it even better. This is especially true for the airport since I use KCI as a visitor now, not a local.
Embrace it. We need people that continue to push KC. This forum is at its best when it's pushing the Overton window of what we allow to be acceptable.
Perhaps less cynicism and more suggestions on improvement.
Nothing super exciting or notable architecturally, but a much needed upgrade over the previous MCI.
If we're being honest, it's a slightly better version of Love Field. Most importantly, it moves us firmly into the upper tier of Mid-Size airports in the United States, which is about what I would expect for what we spent budgetarily.
As a frequent traveler, I'm personally glad we have the basic necessities like Clear and a Delta Lounge.
KCPowercat wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 10:32 am
I've had clear and it saves such a miniscule amount of time I have no idea why people pay for it.
It’s paid for by certain Travel card from the likes of Amex and Chase, so that’s likely where a majority of their customer base comes from. I’ve not met anyone who pays for it directly though.
KCPowercat wrote: ↑Tue Feb 21, 2023 10:32 am
I've had clear and it saves such a miniscule amount of time I have no idea why people pay for it.
It bailed my brother and I out when we were going to DC from STL last spring. We had a membership and it helped us bypass an hour+ wait time for security (we were running late anyways). It's not worth it at a quiet airport, but busy ones, definitely. I have pre-check now, as part of my Global Entry thing, so I no longer use Clear.
Speaking of Pre-Check, will the new KCI have a dedicated are for Pre-Check users or do you just get to cut up in front of everyone anyways?
Having at least one dedicated TSA Pre line is effectively a precondition for Clear to set up shop in the first place, so it's pretty safe to say they'll be over at the right (north) side of the security screening area.
we flew through KCI over the weekend. miserable experience in the AA gates as usual--massive crowds, nothing open other than an overtaxed starbucks and bar. as always, overheard lots of complaints and jokes about how shitty the airport is. however, we chatted with a fellow who attended the simulation and was very happy and showed us photos he took. overheard locals and visitors alike who seemed relieved the old KCI will be a thing of the past as we stood packed like sardines at the gate as arriving passengers squeezed through.
also, anecdotally, lots of folks in my social media sphere are posting they are excited, particularly those (and there are several) who attended the simulations. these are not KCRAG style development/urbanism enthusiasts either--just regular KC folks excited for a new airport.
the online commenters who want to stay with KCI are not only totally idiotic but probably rarely, if ever, fly. truly, any remotely well-traveled person knows that KCI is a total joke that should have been replaced 20 years ago. sure, when the stars align and you park in the terminal garage, zoom thru security, and zoom back out upon arrival, it is great--but for many users there are friction points that make every KCI visit a bummer.
Nearly everybody I talk to in KC loved the current terminal and were against the new one and now they are fans of the new one and act like they always have been.
I really hope the downtown stadium has a similar happy ending. Because right now it gets BLASTED by 95% of people on any social media platform. Although I'm starting to see some people come around on the downtown stadium, I still feel like it will have a much bigger hill to climb than KCI.
Last edited by GRID on Tue Feb 21, 2023 3:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
