Bird Scooters Have Landed

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DaveKCMO
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e-Scooter Share

Postby DaveKCMO » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:38 am

Twelve companies applied for scooter share permits in San Francisco this week, two of them were Uber and Lyft. They're coming...

http://www.govtech.com/fs/Denver-Scramb ... Fleet.html
https://www.wired.com/story/san-francis ... -limebike/
https://www.engadget.com/2018/05/18/boo ... haring-dc/

I rode a Skip while in DC a few weeks ago and it was really fun. Great way to get around, if we can resolve the bike lane and sidewalk questions locally (where can they ride?).

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby earthling » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:45 am

Has Bcycle made any progress with ebikes? They mentioned testing them a year+ ago but not sure if rolled out anywhere yet. Can't find any updates.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby KCPowercat » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:46 am

How can we best prepare as a city? For those who have used these, would they have the power to say go from 3rd and grand up to 8th?

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby DaveKCMO » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:47 am

earthling wrote:Has Bcycle made any progress with ebikes? They mentioned testing them a year+ ago but not sure if rolled out anywhere yet. Can't find any updates.


Electric assist is definitely on Bcycle/Trek's road map. I think delivery was supposed to be this year.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby DaveKCMO » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:49 am

KCPowercat wrote:How can we best prepare as a city? For those who have used these, would they have the power to say go from 3rd and grand up to 8th?


Very slow on hills, in my brief experience, which is why they really should be allowed to use the bike lanes. Speed also capped at 20mph. We need policy changes to ensure the city will allow them to be parked in the right of way and operate as a legitimate business. It could be Uber/Lyft all over again, as we've seen in some other cities. With so many competitors (many VC-backed), a lot of times the scooters appear with a few days notice to cities. Same for e-bikes.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby flyingember » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:50 am

KCPowercat wrote:How can we best prepare as a city? For those who have used these, would they have the power to say go from 3rd and grand up to 8th?

Are we talking about a kids scooter that you stand on and kick with your feet or more of a moped style of scooter you sit on?

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby DaveKCMO » Fri Jun 08, 2018 8:52 am

flyingember wrote:
KCPowercat wrote:How can we best prepare as a city? For those who have used these, would they have the power to say go from 3rd and grand up to 8th?

Are we talking about a kids scooter that you stand on and kick with your feet or more of a moped style of scooter you sit on?


Most of these are "deck" scooters you stand on, like a Razor but with a small electric motor to assist. It doesn't assist until you kick off (like an e-bike).

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby flyingember » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:03 am

In that case, there's no way it should be expected to get the a random person up a hill if they couldn't get up the hill on your own to begin with.

Clearly the motor has enough power to take X pounds up a a certain amount of steepness. There will be a point the motor just won't add anything.

And given how many people are in denial about their weight there will be a case that if they say it can help take someone up hill and it doesn't they file a lawsuit but they were too heavy for that to be realistic.

Better to say it can help but you, the user, are expected to be capable of doing the work on your own and have zero expectation the electric motor will assist.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby earthling » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:04 am

Standing scooters might have its place as an option for short rides but would rather see e-assisted bikes in play. Some of the hills in city aren't fun for casual cyclists and the weight/gear ratios on Bcycle aren't all that great.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby DaveKCMO » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:12 am

earthling wrote:Standing scooters might have its place as an option for short rides but would rather see e-assisted bikes in play. Some of the hills in city aren't fun for casual cyclists and the weight/gear ratios on Bcycle aren't all that great.


My point is we may not have a choice. With twelve players in the private sector and many of them plopping down in cities without much warning, we need to be prepared.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby tower » Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:59 pm

In Atlanta, it seems like these are way more heavily utilized than bike share. Of course, the south is waaayy to hot in the summer for physical activity of any kind. Didn't see any on hills, but it seemed like they had plenty of power. They may struggle on hills, but it would probably be faster than walking.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby DaveKCMO » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:20 pm

tower wrote:In Atlanta, it seems like these are way more heavily utilized than bike share. Of course, the south is waaayy to hot in the summer for physical activity of any kind. Didn't see any on hills, but it seemed like they had plenty of power. They may struggle on hills, but it would probably be faster than walking.


Did you see them riding on sidewalks and/or in bike lanes?

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby tower » Fri Jun 08, 2018 10:50 pm

Sidewalks. I didn't see too many bike lanes though.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby WoodDraw » Sat Jun 09, 2018 2:56 am

Tbf, I don't see many bikes using bike Lanes right now. I don't think there is a burden on bikes having to deal with scooters. I worry still more about them not being protected lanes.

I was walking around p&l today around main I think and there wasn't even enough space for two people to pass each other. Half the sidewalk at least was taken up by planters and double light poles. Now we want to try to maneuver scooters through this?
Last edited by WoodDraw on Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby droopy » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:16 pm

Whoa, is the debate about e-scooters on sidewalks vs street/bike lanes? Having 2 kids and living thru the razor scooter craze (downtown with them) sidewalks would be a nightmare. I thought we were talking bikelane only vs street and was going to say KC doesn’t have enough bike lanes for that to be realistic

I love the concept though. I would be way more likely to use a scooter than one of the bikeshare bikes, which I have never used eventough Ive lived within 100 yards of one of the original stations since it was put in.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby tower » Sat Jun 09, 2018 5:35 pm

droopy wrote:Whoa, is the debate about e-scooters on sidewalks vs street/bike lanes? Having 2 kids and living thru the razor scooter craze sidewalks would be a nightmare. I thought we were talking bikelane only vs street and was going to say KC doesn’t have enough bike lanes for that to be realistic


Ideally they would not be on the sidewalk, but the reality is that people will probably use them on the sidewalk. People who rent a bike or scooter are a lot more likely to use the sidewalk than someone who owns one. A scooter also probably feels more dangerous on a road than a bike. And as you say, having scooters use bike lanes is not realistic without more of bike lanes.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby bspecht » Sun Jun 10, 2018 3:39 am

1. These are just Gen 1 of scooters/e-bikes – these things are going to get better, fast.
2. They should not be on sidewalks, if at all possible.
3. Urban cores NEED bike lanes mobility lanes everywhere to accommodate these ASAP.
4. Vehicles of similar size will be autonomous SOON – this is just a peek at the future of urban mobility.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby tower » Sun Jun 10, 2018 12:34 pm

bspecht, do people with scooters do a pretty good job of staying off sidewalks in DC? There, at least they have bike lanes and enough cyclists that cars know to keep an eye out.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby bspecht » Sun Jun 10, 2018 9:08 pm

They do ok – still tons of room for improvement. DC has a good amount of 'bike' infrastructure, but it really isn't a cohesive network that's convenient go multiple miles on – side streets are best to ride on.

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Re: e-Scooter Share

Postby grecobs » Wed Jun 27, 2018 11:01 am

tower wrote:bspecht, do people with scooters do a pretty good job of staying off sidewalks in DC? There, at least they have bike lanes and enough cyclists that cars know to keep an eye out.


Scooter mania is in full force in SF. KC a will struggle to keep them off the sidewalks bc there aren’t enough protected bike lanes and there isn’t too much foot traffic. That said, the introduction of scooters will help drive the sense of urgency for more non-car infrastructure.

I could see a scooter network doing well from Brooksside to the River Market (aka streetcar) but am curious how the system would do in the winter. Either way, KC is probably a ways off, these companies will probably expand internationally before they come to KC.


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