N/NE JoCo vs. Raytown.

[GRID]

i agree that KCMO needs to promote its beautiful urban core neighborhoods more, but every city in america has its NE JoCo type areas - i.e. expensive, older suburbs where you don't get much house for the money but you're close to the city.  see also:  ladue and webster groves, MO, park ridge, IL, decatur, GA etc.

Yea, but the housing stock is very differnt in those areas IMO.  I like NE JoCo in general.  I just don't think it quite as amazing as many people think.  I guess when I drive down 75 or Antioch, I think Raytown, not Ladue.  But that's just me.

[chrizow]

I guess when I drive down 75 or Antioch, I think Raytown, not Ladue.  But that's just me.

well, if you're thinking of the mission hills aspect of ladue, yes, but a lot of it is like this: http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhom ... source=web   this boring ranch home is $440K because it is in ladue, near the city and $2M homes of clayton/ladue, just like how a ranch or cape cod in PV or fairway is $440K b/c it is near the city and the $2M homes of mission hills.

[GRID]

well, if you're thinking of the mission hills aspect of ladue, yes, but a lot of it is like this: http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhom ... source=web   this boring ranch home is $440K because it is in ladue, near the city and $2M homes of clayton/ladue, just like how a ranch or cape cod in PV or fairway is $440K b/c it is near the city and the $2M homes of mission hills.

What are we talking about here?  What is NE JoCo?  I tend to group the Fairway/Mission Hills area into urban KCMO's country club district.  It's a pretty small area.  I guess you could extend it down south east of Lee Blvd through old Leawood.  But overall, that's a small part of NE JoCo.

When I think NE JoCo, I'm thinking of PV, Mission, Merriam, northern OP, eastern Shawnee etc, a much larger area.

[heatherkay]

well-said.  this is the appeal of NE JoCo - the proximity to the urban core of KCMO.   :)

Well, the proximity of the urban core AND decent public schools. 

[heatherkay]

What are we talking about here?  What is NE JoCo?  I tend to group the Fairway/Mission Hills area into urban KCMO's country club district.

I tend to group them with Kansas.  So does the post office and the federal government. 

[chrizow]

What are we talking about here?  What is NE JoCo?  I tend to group the Fairway/Mission Hills area into urban KCMO's country club district.  It's a pretty small area.  I guess you could extend it down south east of Lee Blvd through old Leawood.  But overall, that's a small part of NE JoCo.

When I think NE JoCo, I'm thinking of PV, Mission, Merriam, northern OP, western Shawnee etc, a much larger area.

i too mentally consider mission hills, fairway, and westwood hills as an extension of KCMO, but they are still part of "NE JoCo."  they also form the "brand" of NE JoCo that people seem to really love, so that raytown house in roeland park that is closer to KCK than mission hills takes on a greater luster.  

Well, the proximity of the urban core AND decent public schools. 

well, yes.

[bobbyhawks]

I don't wish to put down Raytown.  I agree that there are many areas that are very similar to other pockets of NE JoCo, but the definition of what is NE JoCo seems to fluctuate West and South with the argument.

In my opinion, there are quite a few pockets of pretty great houses and mini-hoods in NE JoCo, that are outside of Fairway and Mission Hills.  I am not as familiar with Raytown, so I can't speak to the higher end of their housing stock.  From my experiences in that area, I have seen a combination of houses as described above and some pretty rundown and unkempt areas.  There are quite a few communities in NE JoCo, outside of Fairway and Mission Hills, where houses sell for $500k+.  I am not aware of areas in Raytown where there are many that would go for $300k+.  The price difference can't be tied entirely to location.  PV's average listing price is 265k with 26 homes on Trulia asking over 500k.  Raytown's average is 89k with 3 houses currently asking over 300k.  I agree that there are equivalent areas, but overall, I think they are in different ballparks.  When you throw Fairway and Mission Hills back into the equation, they are in different leagues.

And yes, it is convenient to claim Fairway and Mission Hills as your own when trying to bash on NE JoCo Kansas for being overrated.

[KC_JAYHAWK]

And yes, it is convenient to claim Fairway and Mission Hills as your own when trying to bash on NE JoCo Kansas for being overrated.

  Well said.

[WSPanic]

What are we talking about here?  What is NE JoCo?  I tend to group the Fairway/Mission Hills area into urban KCMO's country club district.

LOL.

[GRID]

I don't claim them.  It's still Kansas .  I just think that is the only area of KS that takes on more of a "KCMO" culture and feel.  The rest of KS, inluding the rest of NE JoCo is not as much KC as it is just Kansas.

The MO side of state Line in the Mission Hills area is better anyway.  :mrgreen:

[chrizow]

i will admit to using a similarly selective "halo effect" in thinking about our house.  

just like a roeland park resident who considers their neighborhood to be an extension of mission hills/fairway instead of KCK, i like to think that our house is an extension of the $1M+ Rockhill homes that are 500 ft across gillham park from our house rather than an extension of the $15K homes an equivalent distance tot he east at 44th and Virginia.  

In my opinion, there are quite a few pockets of pretty great houses and mini-hoods in NE JoCo, that are outside of Fairway and Mission Hills.  I am not as familiar with Raytown, so I can't speak to the higher end of their housing stock.  From my experiences in that area, I have seen a combination of houses as described above and some pretty rundown and unkempt areas.  There are quite a few communities in NE JoCo, outside of Fairway and Mission Hills, where houses sell for $500k+.  I am not aware of areas in Raytown where there are many that would go for $300k+.  The price difference can't be tied entirely to location.  PV's average listing price is 265k with 26 homes on Trulia asking over 500k.  Raytown's average is 89k with 3 houses currently asking over 300k.  I agree that there are equivalent areas, but overall, I think they are in different ballparks.  When you throw Fairway and Mission Hills back into the equation, they are in different leagues.

i agree that the definition of NE JoCo seems to be in flux, but in my world NE JoCo would include extreme north OP, roeland park, etc. and probably also parts of shawnee or merriam, all of which are mostly very, very average and even have some very unkempt areas, even semi-rural areas with no curbs.  they bear zero resemblance to fairway or mission hills.  

[GRID]

I miss this smack though.  Nobody out here does it.  VA vs MD just doesn't have the same friction, nobody cares and there is general respect for one another so there is little reason to have to defend one against the other.

But I have so much more time without all the KS vs MO smack or the KC vs StL smack!

[chingon]

The rest of KS MO, inluding the rest of NE JoCo Raytown and Lee's Summit is not as much KC as it is just Kansas Missourah.

Took care of those typos for you.

The MO side of state Line in the Mission Hills area is better anyway.  :mrgreen:

This part is actually true. Too bad your silliness so often buries your better ideas in bullshit.

[KCMax]

I miss this smack though.  Nobody out here does it.  

Well that explains why you insist on inserting it into every single topic in this forum.

[slimwhitman]

I am always amazed when I roam thru the deep ends of Raytown.  They have some great, stable ’50 & ‘60s era neighborhoods with a very similar feel to older OP or east Shawnee.  They also have a few excellent ‘70s & 80s subdivisions that were on par with homes at 135th & Antioch with 4 bedrooms and 2-3 car garages.  On their own, all those Raytown neighborhoods feel nice and seem fairly stable.  

And let’s not forget some pockets of very nice 1930s-50s homes in Raytown.  Take a drive on Blue Ridge Blvd sometime…some parts are beautiful.  Go from I-70 (near the new Walmart…formerly Blue Ridge Mall) south to “downtown” Raytown  at 63rd Street.  Then take 63rd Street east to Woodson and this takes you into some of the newest and largest homes in Raytown.  These are NICE homes and nice neighborhoods.

When isolated inside some of these nice subdivisions you really do feel like you are in NE JoCo.  But when you get to the arterials you find the density and uniformity falls apart in some parts of Raytown (north Raytown Rd & south Blue Ridge Blvd).  There simply are no lifeless voids on any NE JoCo arterials.  Add in the dis-connectedness from the city center courtesy of the Blue River valley, and Raytown loses some of its luster.  There are also large pockets of micro-tiny homes and shabby neighborhoods in between the nice ones…. stuff that is almost non-existent in NE JoCo.  That hurts the Raytown region.

Let's not forget KCMO's lack of stewardship of the neighborhoods just west of Raytown.  Ouch!  Those areas hurt....and connect directly to Raytown's west side.

When I was in high school in the ‘80s, it seemed the Raytown Schools were 100% on par with the Shawnee Mission Schools.  They were mostly white and a popular place to send your kids (for the average white suburbanite).  I don’t know that it is as popular now for that same demographic.  Everyone I know that went to Raytown high schools in the ‘80s, moved to the outer crust of that slice of pie (stayed in the same city quadrant, but further out to Lees Summit or Independence).  They felt Raytown was no longer an option to safely raise their kids.  That is partly why the home prices stay a bit deflated.

It is very true that parts of NE JoCo are underwhelming.  The 75th St and Antioch corridors as well as Merriam & east Shawnee are perfect examples.  (side note: An old-timer in the handyman industry once told me that they called the 75th Street corridor “Poverty Ridge” because that is where folks of modest means lived and he hated working there because he made less money on those service calls.  He said it was a common phrase.)  But the fact that all these JoCo areas are fully developed and have fully developed collectors and arterials help to make the area more visually appealing.  Add in a better perceived school district and seamless connection to the city-center and the comparison becomes no comparison.

I have hope for Raytown, though.  It has "good bones" to build from.

[KC0KEK]

It is very true that parts of NE JoCo are underwhelming.  The 75th St and Antioch corridors as well as Merriam & east Shawnee are perfect examples.  (side note: An old-timer in the handyman industry once told me that they called the 75th Street corridor “Poverty Ridge” because that is where folks of modest means lived and he hated working there because he made less money on those service calls.  He said it was a common phrase.)  

I'm not to surprised to hear that. When I moved to KC in 1998, I lived in the 79th-Grant area for the first two years because it was a short commute to my office and affordable. By the mid-2000s, I started seeing more and more crime reports for the area.

[bbqboy]

you guys are combining parts of joco built either pre WW2 or immediately post war with the planned subdivisions that sprouted in the 50's, usually taking out existing golf courses.
Maybe chef and maitre d will weigh in just for Grid's sake.
Amd why no love for Westwood and Westwood Hills?

[pash]

.

[shinatoo]

Since I started this smack down I will elaborate on my point.

I used to live in Raytown and work in Mission. I would walk from my house to the GE building at 63rd and Blue Ridge Cutoff to catch the bus. I worked at the 7 story building at 59th and Foxridge. I would go out and walk the neighborhoods at lunch. Every single thing was strangely similar in those neighborhoods (even the house numbers) except for the fact that there were curbs.

Look at this

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... 2,,0,13.72

compared to this

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source= ... .37,,0,2.2

It's the same place. Except in Raytown you pay half as much per square foot.

One day they will get commuter from DT to TSC and out to Raytown and that's the day Raytown will blow up.

[aknowledgeableperson]

NE JoCo is so freaking overated.  Sure pockets are nice or interesting near and around Mission Hills or Fairway, but for the most part, it's raytown and I thought most of raytown had curbs.

Late to the discussion and it is sure interesting.  The big difference between the two areas would be Raytown as one entity whereas N/NE JoCo is a collection of entities, each town alittle different than the other much like the various neighborhoods of Raytown.  Much of Raytown, though, is like KCMO along its borders.  Drive down Blue Ridge or along 87th Street and you can't tell which city you are in.