Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by aknowledgeableperson » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:41 pm

GRID wrote: I don't think you guys realize how much of a population base it takes to support a development like the Legends long term.
Not disputing but wanting to look at this from another angle.

Yes, the Legends and the surrounding area will take a large increase in population to help sustain it.  But given what is being built out there the visitors, tourists, or whatever you want to call them will help the area survive.  This area was not developed to be sustained by just residents otherwise why would NFM be built there?  Cabela's?  The wolf hotel?  The water park?  The race track?  And so on.  This area is not like Independence Center or any other shopping area in the metro.

The P&L was built not just to serve the locals.  If Bartle was not around you would not be seeing the P&L in whatever shape it becomes.  It also will depend on visitors and tourists, oh I'm sorry they should be called conventioners, to help with its survival.

The long-term success of either is guaranteed.  All of the pieces of the puzzle will have to fall into place for them to work.  A piece may be missing for awhile and that will cause a setback at either location.  But as long as the piece is eventually found then the place will go back to working and looking AOK.
I may be right.  I may be wrong.  But there is a lot of gray area in-between.

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by Sussudio » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:48 pm

Power and Light District! Not Strip Mall! Comparing The Great Mall to P&L is like comparing David to Goliath. "Well, they're both male..."

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by aknowledgeableperson » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:51 pm

Yeah.  One should not compare the two.  At least one of them has some stores opened for business.

:lol:
I may be right.  I may be wrong.  But there is a lot of gray area in-between.

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by Sussudio » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:51 pm

But don't forget, the Great Mall gives you cheaper prices than P&L will (lots and lots of sarcasm).

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by Highlander » Thu Feb 14, 2008 5:03 pm

GRID wrote: I don't think you guys realize how much of a population base it takes to support a development like the Legends long term.

The speedway does nothing for retail out there, very little anyway.  Schlitt and the casinos will each have massive retail components of their own.

How on earth do you think a mostly rural area of the city is going to support 2, 3 or even 4 million sq ft of retail when newer developments open in the Northland, Lenexa, OP, Independence etc where there are far more people, a shit ton more highway traffic etc?

It's an honest question.  WyCo needs to really start pushing rooftops now to protect that investment, just like downtown needs to do everything in their power to bring in new residents, businesses and conventions.  Downtown is in the same boat, they don’t have the critical mass of employees, residents and tourists yet either to support 1-2 million sq ft of retail and restaurants in the Loop to Crown Center corridor.  The PAC, Sprint and Barlte will go a long way, but will not be enough to sustain the foot traffic downtown needs to thrive.
My relatives in Lenexa consider The Legends as essentially part of their backyard.  It's a 15-20 minute drive across generally uncrowded highways while going to the much closer Oak Park Mall or other places in the greater OP-Olathe area takes just as long with often congested conditions.  I think you underestimate how convenient this place is to all but the most southern of Johnson Countians.  That all could change with a Joco attraction of greater interest but it's the setting and lack of congestion that makes The Legends a competitor.  The curious visitors from Grandview and Lees Summit will probably quit on the place once the same services are offered at a nearer location but this place will be the place of choice for many in Johnson County for some time to come.   

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by LenexatoKCMO » Thu Feb 14, 2008 5:19 pm

Highlander wrote: My relatives in Lenexa consider The Legends as essentially part of their backyard.  It's a 15-20 minute drive across generally uncrowded highways while going to the much closer Oak Park Mall or other places in the greater OP-Olathe area takes just as long with often congested conditions.  I think you underestimate how convenient this place is to all but the most southern of Johnson Countians.  That all could change with a Joco attraction of greater interest but it's the setting and lack of congestion that makes The Legends a competitor.   The curious visitors from Grandview and Lees Summit will probably quit on the place once the same services are offered at a nearer location but this place will be the place of choice for many in Johnson County for some time to come.   
There have been a hell of a lot of rooftops built in the far western quarter of JoCo and that area is way, way underserved in terms of shopping and dining.  I am sure that will change and commercial developments will fill in out there - but I doubt they get anything on the destination scale of VW.

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by aknowledgeableperson » Thu Feb 14, 2008 9:24 pm

Highlander wrote: My relatives in Lenexa consider The Legends as essentially part of their backyard.  It's a 15-20 minute drive across generally uncrowded highways while going to the much closer Oak Park Mall or other places in the greater OP-Olathe area takes just as long with often congested conditions.     
And just look at the development around SMParkway and 435 in Shawnee.  That makes the trip shorter than the time it would take me to go from south KC to the Plaza.
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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by jimb » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:11 am

LenexatoKCMO wrote: There have been a hell of a lot of rooftops built in the far western quarter of JoCo and that area is way, way underserved in terms of shopping and dining.  I am sure that will change and commercial developments will fill in out there - but I doubt they get anything on the destination scale of VW.
Looks like most of the new retail development is happening south of 151st along US-169.  I went out to visit my brother and was surprised at how that area is sprouting.

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by Highlander » Fri Feb 15, 2008 4:41 pm

aknowledgeableperson wrote: And just look at the development around SMParkway and 435 in Shawnee.  That makes the trip shorter than the time it would take me to go from south KC to the Plaza.
Hardly destination stuff there.  Most people gleefully drive past that on the way to the Legends. 

If you are going to a movie fine but for a nice evening out, most JoCo people from that area head to the Legends.  I know a lot of them that in fact do just that. 

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by trailerkid » Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:08 pm

As reported before...the outlook for Steve & Barry's is not looking good.

GM doesn't even post a mall map on the web site anymore because there are so many missing junior anchors. When will ownership officially pull the plug and try to redevelop the site? I'm certain this location could sustain a decent-sized shopping center with traditional department stores and typical mall fare.

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by justin8216 » Wed Jul 09, 2008 9:16 pm

aknowledgeableperson wrote: And just look at the development around SMParkway and 435 in Shawnee.  That makes the trip shorter than the time it would take me to go from south KC to the Plaza.
Does anyone else think that the WestGlen Theater looks like it is on it's last legs?

I hadn't been to that theater for years and years but they had a movie time more convenient for me so I went and I forgot how crappy that place was. It doesn't even have stadium seating.

And to think, Dickinson claimed it was the "crown jewel" of KC movie theaters when they opened it. Lame.

Then Dickinson opened the Palazo claiming it was going to be the new most extravagant and "luxurious" theater in the Metro KC. It's neither of those.

I would call it lame with annoying fuax Italian music playing over loud speakers in the foyer and hallways driving patrons insane.

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by OPIchabod » Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:27 am

justin8216 wrote: Does anyone else think that the WestGlen Theater looks like it is on it's last legs?

I hadn't been to that theater for years and years but they had a movie time more convenient for me so I went and I forgot how crappy that place was. It doesn't even have stadium seating.

And to think, Dickinson claimed it was the "crown jewel" of KC movie theaters when they opened it. Lame.

Then Dickinson opened the Palazo claiming it was going to be the new most extravagant and "luxurious" theater in the Metro KC. It's neither of those.

I would call it lame with annoying fuax Italian music playing over loud speakers in the foyer and hallways driving patrons insane.
Indeed Justin, nothing will quite compare to the Unified Government-owned Indian Springs Mall and Legends 14 movie theatre...
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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by mgsports » Thu Jul 10, 2008 8:13 pm

If another Wa-mart comes probley at 151TH Street and Pflumm Road and probley Neighborhood Market
TJMAXX and More,IKEA and so on would be good replacements in the Open Air Mall.
Best Buy is what you are think of that's coming to Shawnee by 435.
Last edited by mgsports on Fri Jul 18, 2008 6:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by AlbertHammond » Sat Jul 12, 2008 1:20 pm

trailerkid wrote: When will ownership officially pull the plug and try to redevelop the site? I'm certain this location could sustain a decent-sized shopping center with traditional department stores and typical mall fare.
That thing is too far on the exurban fringe to be successful for another few decades.  This whole $4+ gas problem will keep even more regional shoppers from coming, as well as the potential shoppers that live north of 135th St.  That mall (or the site) doesn't have a chance in hell of getting more retailers or remodeled.  When it finally closes, I bet the mall site redevelops into a non-retail use (a strip center might take the front 1/3 along Parker and the pad sites will stay).

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by debrae64 » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:41 pm

Okay, let's re-open the Factory Outlet Mall in Lawrence, KS that sits on the banks of the Kaw River.  That was a beautiful location.  I used to go there to shop, and it was also relaxing to just sit on that outside patio they had, and watch the Kaw!  I was shocked and disappointed when I came back for a visit to KC/Lawrence, and it was closed.  I guess that's been about six years ago now!  I miss KC!

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by HalcyonKC » Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:01 pm

mgsports wrote: Ifanother Wa-mart comes probley at 151TH Street and Pflumm Road and probey Neighborhood Market
TJMAXX and More,IKEA and so on would be good replacements in the Open Air Mall.
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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by PumpkinStalker » Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:20 pm

HalcyonKC wrote: Help us kcgrammarhawk!

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by kanasalumn » Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:53 pm

Eddie Bauer is finally closing doors this month there.  talks of moving the outlet to the Legends though

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by kanasalumn » Wed Jul 16, 2008 1:54 pm

debrae64 wrote: Okay, let's re-open the Factory Outlet Mall in Lawrence, KS that sits on the banks of the Kaw River.  That was a beautiful location.  I used to go there to shop, and it was also relaxing to just sit on that outside patio they had, and watch the Kaw!  I was shocked and disappointed when I came back for a visit to KC/Lawrence, and it was closed.  I guess that's been about six years ago now!  I miss KC!
If I remember correctly there is a Hotel there now, not sure what half is still vacant, and I know there is Abe and Jakes in that area too

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Re: Dismantling of Great Mall (ongoing)

Post by GuyInLenexa » Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:31 am

I don't see a future for the Great Mall as it stands.  It surprises me that La Quinta built a new hotel on their perimeters.  I understand that a lot of it's business is related to the adjacent hospital.  Medical offices has been the only development on that part of 151st lately.  Perhaps it could be demolished and redeveloped as light industry and/or office space.  I think another major retail area would only end up the same way the mall did.

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