WoodDraw wrote:So with the addition of two more vehicles, what's the plan on how they'll be used? Lower headway times, or just allow for better matenance?
I saw on Twitter would add a fourth into operations and it makes sense. Four trains full time would bring our frequency to a world class level.
At 45 blocks round trip five trains would be a vehicle every 9 blocks. That's going to be 4-5 minute headways. The NYC subway doesn't run every line at that frequency at peak. The very packed Q train, just extended, is 6-8 minute at rush, 8-12 minutes in the evening.
That would be great. I'm not sure comparing us to other cities is helpful though. Like the DC metro can be shit, but where I was staying, it was worth it to wait 15 minutes instead of walking. That's not true in KC. I can walk to river market and I can walk to crossroads in that time. Like what's the point, unless I nail the streetcar just on time?
So if we don't want this to be considered tourist crap, then let's keep talking about ways to improve. Streetcars in traffic are notoriously awful and the main reason we're succeeding is because it's free. Let's keep the conversation going.
shinatoo wrote:You have a three minute walk home and you waited for a streetcar?
No, and I'm struggling to see how you got that from my post. I was just saying it's often quicker to walk down main than wait, and that the estimated times are awful.
I'm a supporter of the streetcar, but let's not obsess over it so much we forget its weaknesses.
You said you were at a stop that said two minutes, you waited 5+ and you could have walked home in the same amount of time. So I inferred that you live somewhere around three to six minutes walk from that stop.
None the less, it's a stupid thing to argue about.
I'm glad you walk and use the streetcar, and I'm jealous of the fact that you have ready access to any kind of public transportation.
WoodDraw wrote:That would be great. I'm not sure comparing us to other cities is helpful though. Like the DC metro can be shit, but where I was staying, it was worth it to wait 15 minutes instead of walking. That's not true in KC. I can walk to river market and I can walk to crossroads in that time. Like what's the point, unless I nail the streetcar just on time?
So if we don't want this to be considered tourist crap, then let's keep talking about ways to improve. Streetcars in traffic are notoriously awful and the main reason we're succeeding is because it's free. Let's keep the conversation going.
Frequency seems to be a proxy for quality. If the city gives up on making downtown work as a whole frequency will suffer.
Knowing the authority is looking at ways to decrease waiting times is exactly what we want to see. If we can't fix the traffic adding a train is a great solution. Reduce the waiting time at stop is easier.
The clickbaity local news articles and their hordes of anti-everything internet commentators about last night's Garth Brooks incident is really starting to piss me off.
Yes, the Streetcar screwed up by promising they'd run an hour later than usual then not sending buses around when it couldn't happen.
However...
The people waiting at the stop had already walked 1/4 to 1/3 mile depending on what side of Sprint Center they exited and which stop they went to, so I doubt it was throngs of "disabled and elderly and pregnant" people like the internet commentators keep implying.
The 12th/Main and 14th/Main stops are halfway along the 2 mile track length. So the most anyone was out was a 1 mile walk. (So BS on all the "my car was 2 miles away so I had to call a cab!" whining.)
If your car was to the south, it's downhill the entire way. If it was to the north, it's downhill after the first 2 blocks.
It was 70 degrees, and clear.
Main Street between RM and US is just about the safest street you could possibly walk on at 11:30pm.
I do get it on the irritation that a bus wasn't sent around, but I'm sick of reading all these claims that people were "stranded" and had no choice but to pay for cabs or Ubers (complete with surge pricing) to drive them to their cars.
Yes, "stranded" is a total stretch. Transporting people is never perfect -- ask an airline, cruise line, or anything else in this space. Shit happens, you apologize, and move on (making process improvements to ensure it doesn't happen again).
DaveKCMO wrote:Yes, "stranded" is a total stretch. Transporting people is never perfect -- ask an airline, cruise line, or anything else in this space. Shit happens, you apologize, and move on (making process improvements to ensure it doesn't happen again).
I like this answer. It was a flub by whomever decided to say they were going to run until midnight and then not doing so and not backing it up with buses...but it happens and the streetcar operations are still learning in their year +2 days of operating....just figure out how to not let it happen again.
I'm sorry but this defensiveness is making everyone look bad. If we're contending that the Streetcar is a serious form of transportation, then when it doesn't function properly, the response can't be "well, you're only a mile from your car so get over it." Is it touristy frou frou that only serves a small select area or is it a real form of transportation? If the answer is that it's a real form of transportation, the response can't be that it's no big deal because you can just walk from one end to the other. Why did we spend $100 million then if it's so easy to go from one end to the other???
Something needs to be done with the area between 12th and Truman. Friday night, I waited 30 minutes for a streetcar. That's never happened before so I figured the timing just wasn't updating properly otherwise I would've taken the MAX. Obviously it's going to run slower when a bunch of people are getting on and off at every stop and there are a ton of pedestrians in the Crossroads. The hangup was around P&L though. We sat through multiple light cycles because of the traffic. I'm sure it did the same thing while it was coming to get us. I think there's one garage for event parking on Main. Cars have no reason to even be on Main as far as I can tell.
What is important (maybe even progress?) is people who attended a Garth Brooks concert now not only use public transportation, they expect it to work efficiently. While it is a shitty thing to happen, this event helps highlight broader issues many people face that probably does not get enough attention.
With expanded patronage and prominence/prestige, the public transportation system (as a whole IMO) will get more scrutiny, but more scrutiny also tends to mean more resources and emphasis on improvement if there are issues. In KC, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. People who formerly never used public transportation now know what its like to have that system fail you when you are relying on it. There is a new and louder chorus for effective, reliable transportation.
The city really should have delayed Monday's opening time rather than revert to a 11pm closure on Sunday, because they _advertised_ the extension until midnight. I wonder if work rules had something to do with this kerfuffle.
I've walked from 12th/ Main to 20th/ Wyandotte when I've just missed the streetcar. Although downhill, it takes 20 minutes at a good clip and there are some busted sidewalks along the way. It's far nicer to take the streetcar. I wouldn't uber, but I can understand that others might -- women in heels will often uber even for just a couple of blocks.
"People who formerly never used public transportation now know what its like to have that system fail you when you are relying on it. There is a new and louder chorus for effective, reliable transportation."
Could also be a new and louder chorus to not expand since it can not be depended on. Plain and simple there was a screw up. And usually screw ups creative more negativity, especially in the short term, than highlight the need for positive changes.
Top 12 KC Streetcar Ridership Days as of April 19, 2017
1. May 6, 2017: 17,267 *One year anniversary
2. July 16, 2016: 15,780
3. April 15, 2017: 14,965
4. May 7, 2016: 14,648
5. September 3, 2016: 14,013
6. April 22, 2017: 13,998
7. July 30, 2016: 13,841
8. August 6, 2016: 13,610
9. August 20, 2016: 13,504
10. July 23, 2016: 13,491
11. May 5, 2017: 13,476
12. February 18, 2017: 13,384
I still think its absurd that all of the doors don't automatically open when the streetcar is busy. I tried to get off a one stop while all the Garth brooks crowd was on the streetcar and I asked them to open the door while trying to squeeze through all the people to get to the door while holding a 4 year old. I ended up missing my stop because of the people blocking the door that were too dumb to move or open it for me. So I had to carry the 4 year old an extra 2 blocks, not that big a deal, but when the streetcar has 200 people on it, open the fucking doors at every stop... fuck...
