We need a new airport!!!

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Highlander
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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby Highlander » Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:59 am

nomadcowatbk wrote:
Highlander wrote:
WoodDraw wrote:Missouri could undercut any Kansas airport in one day. The state would have to issue the bonds and even then...

One of the main points the recent proposals made was that kci has runway infrastructure that other cities would beg for. A Kansas airport is a pipedream.



Kansas isn't going to replace KCI but the idea of a second competing airport isn't as far fetched as people think it is. All they need is an airline to agree and FAA approval. They certainly have the nearby customer base that would more than welcome it. If a new terminal is voted down by Kansas City, I believe this could and probably will happen at some point in the not too distant future.


Doesn't United fly 767s into KCI occasionally?


Maybe occasionally. Not sure, certainly not a regular basis. The largest jet at KCI I thought was the 175 seat 737. KCI cannot really handle anything much larger because of its security configuration and the narrow nature of the gates behind security.

Not sure if the Olathe Airport can handle the larger 737's so SW going there would be questionable but they can certainly handle regional jets which comprises the bulk of KCI flights.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby im2kull » Mon Oct 09, 2017 1:40 am

Highlander wrote:
WoodDraw wrote:Missouri could undercut any Kansas airport in one day. The state would have to issue the bonds and even then...

One of the main points the recent proposals made was that kci has runway infrastructure that other cities would beg for. A Kansas airport is a pipedream.


A second airport is not that much of a pipe dream. Kansas has pursued using New Century in Olathe for commercial flights before (they made a fairly concerted push in the late 80's) but could never get an airline to sign on. New Century is the formal Olathe Naval Air Station and has runways that can handle large commercial jets. New Century's long runway can handle 737's in both wet and dry conditions - that's the largest jet that currently flies into KCI.

Kansas isn't going to replace KCI but the idea of a second competing airport isn't as far fetched as people think it is. All they need is an airline to agree and FAA approval. They certainly have the nearby customer base that would more than welcome it. If a new terminal is voted down by Kansas City, I believe this could and probably will happen at some point in the not too distant future.


Please don't comment on things you have no professional experience with. Please. Suggesting new century is a laughable idea. I'll leave it at that.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby flyingember » Mon Oct 09, 2017 7:39 am

New Century is slightly bigger than Midway and the runways are basically the same length. It's not too much off the size of Punta Gorda airport, which Allegiant flies from KCI into, while other airlines use the main Ft. Meyers airport. And that metro is 1/3 the size of KC

Oh, it might not be feasible *right now* but it's not laughable. It could serve a small budget airline and there's just enough space to eminent domain and expand to do this.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby ldai_phs » Mon Oct 09, 2017 7:50 am

im2kull wrote:
Highlander wrote:
WoodDraw wrote:Missouri could undercut any Kansas airport in one day. The state would have to issue the bonds and even then...

One of the main points the recent proposals made was that kci has runway infrastructure that other cities would beg for. A Kansas airport is a pipedream.


A second airport is not that much of a pipe dream. Kansas has pursued using New Century in Olathe for commercial flights before (they made a fairly concerted push in the late 80's) but could never get an airline to sign on. New Century is the formal Olathe Naval Air Station and has runways that can handle large commercial jets. New Century's long runway can handle 737's in both wet and dry conditions - that's the largest jet that currently flies into KCI.

Kansas isn't going to replace KCI but the idea of a second competing airport isn't as far fetched as people think it is. All they need is an airline to agree and FAA approval. They certainly have the nearby customer base that would more than welcome it. If a new terminal is voted down by Kansas City, I believe this could and probably will happen at some point in the not too distant future.


Please don't comment on things you have no professional experience with. Please. Suggesting new century is a laughable idea. I'll leave it at that.

KCI's largest regular scheduled plane would be the 757's and A321's I believe.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby WoodDraw » Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:48 am

flyingember wrote:New Century is slightly bigger than Midway and the runways are basically the same length. It's not too much off the size of Punta Gorda airport, which Allegiant flies from KCI into, while other airlines use the main Ft. Meyers airport. And that metro is 1/3 the size of KC

Oh, it might not be feasible *right now* but it's not laughable. It could serve a small budget airline and there's just enough space to eminent domain and expand to do this.


Ft. Meyers serves far more than their metro area.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby beautyfromashes » Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:50 am

New Century is laughable. Feasible, but laughable. First, the feds would never approve a second location for an airport in such a tiny metro. They’d never get past the first hurdle.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby KCFan » Mon Oct 09, 2017 9:18 am

beautyfromashes wrote:New Century is laughable. Feasible, but laughable. First, the feds would never approve a second location for an airport in such a tiny metro. They’d never get past the first hurdle.


Doesn't St. Louis have two airports? I don't know how you can be so sure of anything with a conservative state and Trump as the President. You have to remember they're not talking about doing anything big (8-10 gates). All you need is one airline that says we're in and close to half of KCI's passengers now are from Kansas. Missouri seems to look down its nose at Kansas all the time but Kansas has become a formidable rival and it's mostly Missouri's fault because Missouri never takes Kansas seriously. Kansas has grown up and is the economic strength of the metro now, which is pretty amazing considering the 75-100 year head start Missouri side had.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby beautyfromashes » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:17 am

Kansas will be Raytown in 30 years.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby aknowledgeableperson » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:21 am

"Doesn't St. Louis have two airports?"

Different time and different place. Besides that 2nd airport was as much a product of the Illinois state government than the local government. And I don't see the present state government of Kansas doing much to support the effort of an alternative to KCI.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby KCFan » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:31 am

Kansas is very pro business and Johnson County holds a lot of sway. If they think an airport will help bring them a bunch of business, they will be all in. Much like they developed STAR bonds to land the Kansas Speedway. There's more than a few Kansans that would love to not have to drive to Missouri for the airport. There's enough money and wealth to make a run at a small terminal. Brownback already publicly admitted they're exploring it and the incoming Governor wouldn't say that an airport was dead. And from what I've been told from some Chamber folks, Kansas is still looking into it (granted that info is 3 months old now and it could have changed). The only way to completely kill it is to build a new terminal for KCI. If it fails, it will be back to the drawing board and hard telling what shakes out, but anyone that thinks the current iteration of KCI is going to survive as is the next 2 decades is crazy.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby beautyfromashes » Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:24 pm

^ The speedway and a few $m fir Union Station- Kansas’ only civic contribution to making this city better.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby KCPowercat » Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:39 pm

Highlander wrote:
nomadcowatbk wrote:
Highlander wrote:

Kansas isn't going to replace KCI but the idea of a second competing airport isn't as far fetched as people think it is. All they need is an airline to agree and FAA approval. They certainly have the nearby customer base that would more than welcome it. If a new terminal is voted down by Kansas City, I believe this could and probably will happen at some point in the not too distant future.


Doesn't United fly 767s into KCI occasionally?


Maybe occasionally. Not sure, certainly not a regular basis. The largest jet at KCI I thought was the 175 seat 737. KCI cannot really handle anything much larger because of its security configuration and the narrow nature of the gates behind security.

Not sure if the Olathe Airport can handle the larger 737's so SW going there would be questionable but they can certainly handle regional jets which comprises the bulk of KCI flights.


A321 is the biggest according to KCI peeps

https://twitter.com/JustinMeyerKC/statu ... 5875273728

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby brewcrew1000 » Mon Oct 09, 2017 2:42 pm

The Threat of Kansas taking the airport should be an angle the city should play to sway voters. The Entire Northland would probably vote yes if that was the case.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby Highlander » Mon Oct 09, 2017 10:57 pm

im2kull wrote:
Highlander wrote:
WoodDraw wrote:Missouri could undercut any Kansas airport in one day. The state would have to issue the bonds and even then...

One of the main points the recent proposals made was that kci has runway infrastructure that other cities would beg for. A Kansas airport is a pipedream.


A second airport is not that much of a pipe dream. Kansas has pursued using New Century in Olathe for commercial flights before (they made a fairly concerted push in the late 80's) but could never get an airline to sign on. New Century is the formal Olathe Naval Air Station and has runways that can handle large commercial jets. New Century's long runway can handle 737's in both wet and dry conditions - that's the largest jet that currently flies into KCI.

Kansas isn't going to replace KCI but the idea of a second competing airport isn't as far fetched as people think it is. All they need is an airline to agree and FAA approval. They certainly have the nearby customer base that would more than welcome it. If a new terminal is voted down by Kansas City, I believe this could and probably will happen at some point in the not too distant future.


Please don't comment on things you have no professional experience with. Please. Suggesting new century is a laughable idea. I'll leave it at that.


Give me a break. Johnson County aggressively pursued bringing commercial flights into New Century in the 80's and came damn close to pulling it off. They were not trying to supplant KCI, but they were absolutely trying to secure regularly scheduled commercial flights. The runways are long enough to handle the vast majority of flights that come into KCI. The airport presently doesn't have the complete infrastructure to handle commercial flights nor did it in the 80's but that is not an insurmountable problem. Let's be perfectly honest hear, Kansas has the political will to do this. They certainly have a nearby market and it's not a stretch to think that an airline, either one present now at KCI or one entering the market, may view a Johnson County airport as a competitive advantage over KCI and the airlines that are entrenched there.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby Highlander » Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:56 pm

beautyfromashes wrote:^ The speedway and a few $m fir Union Station- Kansas’ only civic contribution to making this city better.


They don't want to make the KC better. They want to make Johnson County better. They will have an interest.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby aknowledgeableperson » Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:59 pm

Anybody know how many commercial flights that St. Louis area airport in Illinois have on an average day?

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby ldai_phs » Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:03 am

none..... I don't think they even have daily flights

Update. They Average about 6/10ths a commercial flight a day(or just 4 per week). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdzWhd459_A

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby warwickland » Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:06 am

ldai_phs wrote:none..... I don't think they even have daily flights

Update. They Average about 6/10ths a commercial flight a day(or just 4 per week). https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdzWhd459_A


i think it's more than that, now.

direct flights from the airport website:

SANFORD/ORLANDO (SFB)

TAMPA BAY/ST. PETE (PIE)

LAS VEGAS (LAS)

FT. MYERS/PUNTA GORDA (PGD)

DESTIN/FT. WALTON BEACH (VPS)

JACKSONVILLE (JAX)

MYRTLE BEACH, SC (MYR)

FT. LAUDERDALE, FL (FLL)

PHOENIX/MESA, AZ (AZA)(STARTING NOVEMBER 2017)

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby warwickland » Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:07 am

it's basically an airport for cheap flights to the sunbelt (plus cargo) for illinois retirees and college kids from what i can tell. 157,000 passengers in 2016.

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Re: We need a new airport!!!

Postby flyingember » Tue Oct 10, 2017 1:37 pm

That's all Allegiant. It basically shows how realistic it is for a small airport in JoCo to gain an airline that crosses the whole country. It happened in St. Louis, they're not based out of Lambert too.

Between Denver, Chicago, Dallas and Atlanta they serve at least 20 small towns that KCI has zero direct flights to today like Little Rock, Oklahoma City, Omaha, Des Moines.

I keep thinking the airport in Kansas has to be big to have an impact, but all it needs to do is start with one airline to have an impact. Imagine Kansas having all those flights.


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