KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Transportation topics in KC
Post Reply
earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 4564
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by earthling » Tue Dec 05, 2017 12:02 pm

Big things are expected to spring from a 2-acre site at the northwest corner of 12th and Charlotte streets on the east side of the downtown freeway loop. The Kansas City Area Transportation Authority acquired the site, currently a surface parking lot, last month from Barber & Sons Co. and plans to spend about $1 million to develop a replacement there for the congested transit plaza at 10th and Main streets, which is a transfer point for more than 30 KCATA bus routes.
Other mentions...
- 3rd/Grand $112M office tower, 900 space garage, transit center
- P&R garage and mobility center are planned on an adjacent 4-acre site that Veolia North America formerly used as a coal yard.
- KCATA is preparing to seek mixed-use, transit-oriented development proposals for its headquarters at 1200 E. 18th St. and vacant ground it owns across Forest Avenue to the west.
- Transform the area around the 75th Street and Prospect Avenue MAX stop, which is home to Alphapointe, a nonprofit that provides job training and employment for the blind and visually impaired, transform the area into an innovation hub for the disabled. Refers to a coffee shop or QuickTrip that caters to disabled at transit center.

https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... pment.html

If the City pushes developers toward TOD development for every single new project near transit stops (creating a pedestrian integrated experience with sidewalk retail rather than isolated walled gardens), TOD will occur faster than City sponsored projects. For Midtown too.

flyingember
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 6834
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by flyingember » Tue Dec 05, 2017 1:27 pm

Why does TOD only have to be in the urban core?

That seems to be the missing piece. Easily 3/4 of city residents are in a suburban area

User avatar
Eon Blue
Colonnade
Colonnade
Posts: 947
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:28 pm
Location: Downtown KCMO

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by Eon Blue » Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:22 pm

So...much...parking... for River Market. Add this to the city garages around 5th & Main and it paints a problematic picture for our best mixed-use downtown neighborhood.

earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 4564
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by earthling » Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:37 pm

P&R garages are fine located near the streetcar line. It will help get rid of other surface lots along the line as they can use these garages. The lots are at the edges of RM anyway. The next ideal spot for P&R garage would be near Paseo Bridge when streetcar is extended to Riverfront, would allow much fewer cars entering into downtown. Until we have effective metro wide rail transit, P&R garages along streetcar is a reasonable compromise.

User avatar
smh
Broadway Square
Broadway Square
Posts: 2966
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:40 pm
Location: Central Loop

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by smh » Tue Dec 05, 2017 2:55 pm

Eon Blue wrote:So...much...parking... for River Market. Add this to the city garages around 5th & Main and it paints a problematic picture for our best mixed-use downtown neighborhood.
The word is the 5th and Main garages are no more.

mean
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 10739
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2003 9:00 am
Location: Historic Northeast

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by mean » Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:21 pm

flyingember wrote:Why does TOD only have to be in the urban core?

That seems to be the missing piece. Easily 3/4 of city residents are in a suburban area
Well, if you start doing TOD in suburban areas... won't they stop being suburban areas?

User avatar
normalthings
Alameda Tower
Alameda Tower
Posts: 1105
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by normalthings » Tue Dec 05, 2017 3:26 pm

earthling wrote:
Big things are expected to spring from a 2-acre site at the northwest corner of 12th and Charlotte streets on the east side of the downtown freeway loop. The Kansas City Area Transportation Authority acquired the site, currently a surface parking lot, last month from Barber & Sons Co. and plans to spend about $1 million to develop a replacement there for the congested transit plaza at 10th and Main streets, which is a transfer point for more than 30 KCATA bus routes.
Other mentions...
- 3rd/Grand $112M office tower, 900 space garage, transit center
- P&R garage and mobility center are planned on an adjacent 4-acre site that Veolia North America formerly used as a coal yard.
- KCATA is preparing to seek mixed-use, transit-oriented development proposals for its headquarters at 1200 E. 18th St. and vacant ground it owns across Forest Avenue to the west.
- Transform the area around the 75th Street and Prospect Avenue MAX stop, which is home to Alphapointe, a nonprofit that provides job training and employment for the blind and visually impaired, transform the area into an innovation hub for the disabled. Refers to a coffee shop or QuickTrip that caters to disabled at transit center.

https://www.bizjournals.com/kansascity/ ... pment.html

If the City pushes developers toward TOD development for every single new project near transit stops (creating a pedestrian integrated experience with sidewalk retail rather than isolated walled gardens), TOD will occur faster than City sponsored projects. For Midtown too.
Any details of size of third and grand project.

flyingember
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 6834
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by flyingember » Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:21 pm

mean wrote:
flyingember wrote:Why does TOD only have to be in the urban core?

That seems to be the missing piece. Easily 3/4 of city residents are in a suburban area
Well, if you start doing TOD in suburban areas... won't they stop being suburban areas?
Exactly. And when you think this way, a train towards the airport (even built in phases) doesn't look so crazy

User avatar
DaveKCMO
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 16628
Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2005 6:22 pm
Location: Crossroads
Contact:

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by DaveKCMO » Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:25 pm

flyingember wrote:Why does TOD only have to be in the urban core?

That seems to be the missing piece. Easily 3/4 of city residents are in a suburban area

because that's where the transit is (and where it works best).

flyingember
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 6834
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by flyingember » Tue Dec 05, 2017 4:40 pm

DaveKCMO wrote:
flyingember wrote:Why does TOD only have to be in the urban core?

That seems to be the missing piece. Easily 3/4 of city residents are in a suburban area

because that's where the transit is (and where it works best).
Most of the bus system today is in suburban areas.

The suburbs start, give or take, at 47th on the south and Paseo on the east.

N. Oak looks a lot like Wornall.
One can argue a cultural difference but it's not like N. Oak doesn't have bus service. We just haven't pushed to develop the corridor as if it does.

User avatar
DaveKCMO
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 16628
Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2005 6:22 pm
Location: Crossroads
Contact:

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by DaveKCMO » Tue Dec 05, 2017 5:11 pm

Eon Blue wrote:So...much...parking... for River Market. Add this to the city garages around 5th & Main and it paints a problematic picture for our best mixed-use downtown neighborhood.
i think i heard that 5th and main garage may be on hold...

User avatar
FangKC
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 12982
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 10:02 pm
Location: Old Northeast -- Indian Mound

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by FangKC » Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:15 pm

earthling wrote:
Big things are expected to spring from a 2-acre site at the northwest corner of 12th and Charlotte streets on the east side of the downtown freeway loop. The Kansas City Area Transportation Authority acquired the site, currently a surface parking lot, last month from Barber & Sons Co. and plans to spend about $1 million to develop a replacement there for the congested transit plaza at 10th and Main streets, which is a transfer point for more than 30 KCATA bus routes.
I checked KIVA and it appears the Business Journal incorrectly reported the location of the parcels. Barber & Sons owned the parcels on the southeast corner of 12th and Charlotte, not the northwest.

I don't get why they even need off-street transit parcels. NYC seems to be able to run bus transit and only have stops along the streets, and there are a helluva lot more bus riders, and traffic, all day long there than here.

It also seems to me that those parcels seem a long way from the center of the Loop for a transit center. If you work at 7th and Broadway, it's a fair distance to walk to catch a bus. Actually, it pretty much doubles the distance you have to walk.

mean
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 10739
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2003 9:00 am
Location: Historic Northeast

Re: KC transit-oriented development push (TOD)

Post by mean » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:33 pm

flyingember wrote:
mean wrote:
flyingember wrote:Why does TOD only have to be in the urban core?

That seems to be the missing piece. Easily 3/4 of city residents are in a suburban area
Well, if you start doing TOD in suburban areas... won't they stop being suburban areas?
Exactly. And when you think this way, a train towards the airport (even built in phases) doesn't look so crazy
Are you kidding? These people loathe urbanity and density. They can't even handle parking downtown. We bring the city to the suburbs, the suburbs move further away. Have you read the Star?

Post Reply