Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Transportation topics in KC
Post Reply
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Post by earthling »

Tangent from the Westport thread....

Would like to see Orange line MAX stops/shelters along Midtown to Plaza converted to same as downtown streetcar stops with level boarding, in anticipation of streetcar eventually approved through Midtown. It would at least raise the profile of MAX in the meantime as visitors/transit timid who get to know the downtown streetcar stops may be more comfortable taking MAX between downtown/Plaza given it would the same familiar stop format. The old MAX stop shelters can be moved to a new MAX line elsewhere in city.

Given KC ATA isn't associated with streetcar, might be more complicated than that but is this plausible?
kboish
Hotel President
Hotel President
Posts: 3258
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 12:25 am
Location: West Plaza

Re: Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Post by kboish »

If ATA is spending money on Max stops, I'd rather see realignment to Grand through DT then level boarding stops in midtown in anticipation of streetcar. This irritates me to no end (the alignment, not your suggestion of level boarding). It will get worse as the construction of the convention hotel gets underway.
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Post by earthling »

Yeah, I'd like to see that too, but if Midtown to Plaza MAX stops are upgraded to same as streetcar, would be ready for streetcar and perhaps entice more MAX usage in meantime - especially visitors and transit timid. And it will take many years to get streetcar to UMKC.
mykn

Re: Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Post by mykn »

Is the proposed streetcar route running on the edge of the street, or center running? That might change how feasible it would be to conver max stops now.

Personally, I'm all in favor of dedicated center running through most of midtown.
flyingember
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 9862
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Post by flyingember »

the track slab is actually partially underneath the stop. You can't install them first for that reason

The slab filled 70-80% of the trench dug. Remember, they need to put a form in on the outside of the concrete. And you could almost always tell exactly where the stop was going because the concrete at the tracks was wider than elsewhere along the line.

If you go and stand at the edge of the stop step back 2-3 feet and you will need to tear out the concrete in front of you to have enough space install the track.

AND the stop installation relied on the conduit install which runs alongside the track in the gravel base under the slab. It goes to every stop for the lighting and data. its not just a stop, it's an integrated system
User avatar
DaveKCMO
Ambassador
Posts: 20039
Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2005 6:22 pm
Location: Crossroads
Contact:

Re: Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Post by DaveKCMO »

earthling wrote:Tangent from the Westport thread....

Would like to see Orange line MAX stops/shelters along Midtown to Plaza converted to same as downtown streetcar stops with level boarding, in anticipation of streetcar eventually approved through Midtown. It would at least raise the profile of MAX in the meantime as visitors/transit timid who get to know the downtown streetcar stops may be more comfortable taking MAX between downtown/Plaza given it would the same familiar stop format. The old MAX stop shelters can be moved to a new MAX line elsewhere in city.

Given KC ATA isn't associated with streetcar, might be more complicated than that but is this plausible?
this might technically be possible, but given what happened in DC -- streetcar infrastructure installed before the entire system was designed (an activity which itself costs millions) -- it's something no engineer would touch. it also would preclude a center-running streetcar (all of our buses have doors that only allow curb boarding). on that point alone, i say don't bother since a center-running extension will be safer for cyclists and would run less afoul of parked cars.

i'd rather focus resources on off-board ticketing for all MAX routes, straitening the routes, improving/expanding signal priority, and beefing up sunday and evening service. as it stands today, fare payment is probably ahead of disabled boarding as a source of delays.

it's worth remembering that the vehicles are the most expensive part of a new transit line outside of consulting fees. to move MAX shelters to another route wouldn't serve much of a purpose if you didn't have money to upgrade the vehicles (although at this point it's basically a red-vs-blue paint job, but the actual MAX vehicles are a tad longer than the standard 40' bus).
earthling
Mark Twain Tower
Mark Twain Tower
Posts: 8519
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm
Location: milky way, orion arm

Re: Propose upgrading some MAX Orange line stops as streetcar stops

Post by earthling »

Thanks for feedback. Can see the complications trying to do ahead of streetcar design but do see benefits of matching MAX stops to streetcar style stops with level boarding and familiarity for timid riders, even if streetcar never extends to UMKC (or takes a decade).
Post Reply