New Broadway Bridge

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ldai_phs
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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby ldai_phs » Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:25 am

NorthOak wrote:
ldai_phs wrote:1. Doubling the lanes is literally impossible.


No, it's literally not impossible.
1) Look at a satellite image after the bridge. 2 more lanes can be added by encroaching into the Airport.
R. Gebaur Rd, the frontage to Wheeler has virtually NO traffic on it at all.
A flyover would be required between Armour and the Water facility, that would be costly but still doable.
It wouldn't be easy, but there is certainly room to do it.
After the flyover there's enough room to add as many lanes as desired to I-29.
Other cities build these flyovers, they are a necessity.
MODOT and KC always take the cheapest possible road.
Southwest Trafficway/ I-35 southwest out of the loop is a perfect example.
That should have been an elevated highway at least until the fork.
Instead MODOT kept the old (grounded) roadway and merely added lanes and ramps, cutting off the West Side from downtown.
If it can be done cheaper and less safe - MODOT will find a way.


No one has bridge envy - unless it's you.
The bridge assessment of other cities shows how pathetic MODOT and KC have been to transitioning the river.
And while better public transit is needed, your mantra of "less highways" is partial insanity.
You simply don't live in the real world.


We have no money. If we can't even build a bridge to replace one about to fall over why would we build a very expensive flyover? The airport access road can't really be removed. How will people drive to buildings at the airport?
I'm not saying we should remove all our highways, I'm saying that looking to expand every road into downtown now for the demand that may occur is 2047 is dumb and a waste of money. The current 69 is 4 lanes wide. The problem is not the lack of capacity but the bottleneck created by the sharpish turn of the bridge and the lights once you cross over to "Downtown". Fixing this by building a new bridge would help improve traffic flow immensely.
Let alone the people of the Northland don't want it to turn into a "Johnson County" of massive highways.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby flyingember » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:20 am

There's no good ways to widen it anyways.

The trench at Briarcliff will be stupid expensive to widen and redoing the interchange with 9 and I-29 on either end even more so.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby TheLastGentleman » Mon Oct 02, 2017 11:59 am

How would you even widen a bridge like this? The metal frame is in the way. I feel like I'm missing something here.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby flyingember » Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:18 pm

TheLastGentleman wrote:How would you even widen a bridge like this? The metal frame is in the way. I feel like I'm missing something here.

You do it during the planned replacement bridge project.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby TheLastGentleman » Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:36 pm

flyingember wrote:
TheLastGentleman wrote:How would you even widen a bridge like this? The metal frame is in the way. I feel like I'm missing something here.

You do it during the planned replacement bridge project.

Maybe I was reading his posts wrong, but it seemed like NorthOak was suggesting maintaining the current bridge but somehow also widening it. I understand that a new bridge would naturally be wider, but I don't understand how the current bridge could be widened.

Again, I could be misinterpreting something, but that's what I got out of it.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby ldai_phs » Mon Oct 02, 2017 3:48 pm

TheLastGentleman wrote:
flyingember wrote:
TheLastGentleman wrote:How would you even widen a bridge like this? The metal frame is in the way. I feel like I'm missing something here.

You do it during the planned replacement bridge project.

Maybe I was reading his posts wrong, but it seemed like NorthOak was suggesting maintaining the current bridge but somehow also widening it. I understand that a new bridge would naturally be wider, but I don't understand how the current bridge could be widened.

Again, I could be misinterpreting something, but that's what I got out of it.

I reread his originally post and he said he thinks we should build a new bridge, but it should be 8 lanes wide as should the rest of the highway. :roll: [-X
Great Idea

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby im2kull » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:01 am

ldai_phs wrote: I also don't think 30-50 Million to keep the bridge from falling over is worth the cost to help the 50 people who walk across the river every day.


But spending 25 times that amount, you know...Billions of dollars...to help Cerner build a "Members Only" suburban office complex surrounded by a sea of parking is worth the cost?

I'd rather pay to help 50 people walk across the river.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby ldai_phs » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:34 am

What I meant is that if a brand new bridge has large sidewalks anyways, I don't see the purpose in keeping the old bridge as a pedestrian-only bridge as suggested. Also, I am far from supportive of Cerner's Office Park.

Also, I apologize if i came out as very aggressive.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby DaveKCMO » Thu Nov 09, 2017 8:00 pm

http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/ar ... 60706.html

The $6 million cost-sharing agreement, which would repair only the most urgent problems, would allow work to begin in late spring or early summer and would take five to six months to complete.

The work won’t completely shut down the bridge — two lanes of traffic headed north out of downtown will likely remain open. Drivers headed south into downtown, however, may have to use the Heart of America or Bond bridge to the east or the U.S. 69 River Bridge to the west.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby KCPowercat » Fri Nov 10, 2017 9:32 am

Why not cut the concrete medians and allow for one lane each direction?

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby ldai_phs » Fri Nov 10, 2017 9:35 am

KCPowercat wrote:Why not cut the concrete medians and allow for one lane each direction?

I think that the thinking was if they keep limited traffic in both directions, there will be traffic flow issues(Traffic Jams). By keeping just one side open they can force anyone coming the other way to use another route.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby KCPowercat » Fri Nov 10, 2017 9:40 am

Guess that's true. Seem like a real pain for wheeler airport users.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby flyingember » Fri Nov 10, 2017 11:56 am

Related, by sending everyone outbound going south through Harlem it gets a lot more eyes on the neighborhood.

Best way to encourage redevelopment is to have people talking about how bad an area is

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby scooterj » Fri Nov 10, 2017 6:39 pm

flyingember wrote:Related, by sending everyone outbound going south through Harlem it gets a lot more eyes on the neighborhood.

Best way to encourage redevelopment is to have people talking about how bad an area is



They'll almost certainly officially divert at 9 and only let airport/VML traffic through. Harlem Rd & Atlantic are too crappy to send that much traffic through, especially with all the trains that frequently block that route.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby DaveKCMO » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:52 pm

the fight for locally-programmed federal funds just got real:

That TTPC recommend allocating $40 million for the project over the next two programming cycles for FFY
2021-2024, provided that the City of Kansas City, Missouri not apply for other STP funds during this period,
and that MARC review the project again in 2019
to ensure that reasonable progress has be made in
securing remaining funding and completing key project development activities prior to the 2020 call for
projects.


of course, the main street extension of streetcar had identified STP funds as a need.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby Riverite » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:54 pm

I'm sorry what does that mean exactly?

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby Riverite » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:55 pm

DId the bridge get it but now the streetcar won't qualify?

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby flyingember » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:05 pm

Riverite wrote:DId the bridge get it but now the streetcar won't qualify?

The problem is it would qualify. They don't want other parts of town to be left out of the funding.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby DaveKCMO » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:12 pm

Riverite wrote:DId the bridge get it but now the streetcar won't qualify?


the city could not be the applicant for an STP grant for any project -- including streetcar -- between 2021-2024 (2021 is the earliest option). technically, another entity could apply for streetcar but the same people will be making the funding decisions (and even if they change, they'll have the same perspective).

you could argue that the programming commitees are flawed -- and they are -- but there's little interest in upsetting the order. in fact, MARC has only been adding applicants: every rinky-dink municipality in nine counties can jockey for funds.

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Re: New Broadway Bridge

Postby ldai_phs » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:54 pm

DaveKCMO wrote:
Riverite wrote:DId the bridge get it but now the streetcar won't qualify?


the city could not be the applicant for an STP grant for any project -- including streetcar -- between 2021-2024 (2021 is the earliest option). technically, another entity could apply for streetcar but the same people will be making the funding decisions (and even if they change, they'll have the same perspective).

you could argue that the programming commitees are flawed -- and they are -- but there's little interest in upsetting the order. in fact, MARC has only been adding applicants: every rinky-dink municipality in nine counties can jockey for funds.

I don't know how MARC decides new entrance signs for Parkville is a worthy cause while a New Broadway Bridge and Streetcar Expansion are both pushing it.


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