KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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DaveKCMO
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by DaveKCMO »

part two of the CSA involves downtown routing. take the survey here: http://www.kcata.org/maps_schedules/downtown_transit/
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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DaveKCMO wrote:part two of the CSA involves downtown routing. take the survey here: http://www.kcata.org/maps_schedules/downtown_transit/
survey still open until the end of june.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by DaveKCMO »

part of the downtown CSA has been absorbed into the prospect MAX project (moving E/W routes to 12th, with a contraflow bus lane through the loop). this would result in a bus every minute during peak hours, which would be a huge boost for downtown circulation.

11th would then host the bike lanes that were planned for an 11th/12th pair, which makes loads of sense because of the dramatically lower traffic volumes on 11th.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by chingon »

DaveKCMO wrote:(moving E/W routes to 12th, with a contraflow bus lane through the loop).
So, a dedicated westbound bus lane on 12th thru the Loop?

Would that be the first dedicated bus lane in the city?
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by flyingember »

chingon wrote:
DaveKCMO wrote:(moving E/W routes to 12th, with a contraflow bus lane through the loop).
So, a dedicated westbound bus lane on 12th thru the Loop?

Would that be the first dedicated bus lane in the city?
Nope. Oak, 10th to 11th has one
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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flyingember wrote:
Nope. Oak, 10th to 11th has one
Did not know that. 24 hrs? Or is it like the unenforced MAX lane thru midtown that's supposedly bus only for a couple hours morning and evening, but is in reality the city's longest loading dock?


Also, is that the plan for 12th, did I understand Dave's post correctly?
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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chingon wrote:
flyingember wrote:
Nope. Oak, 10th to 11th has one
Did not know that. 24 hrs? Or is it like the unenforced MAX lane thru midtown that's supposedly bus only for a couple hours morning and evening, but is in reality the city's longest loading dock?

Also, is that the plan for 12th, did I understand Dave's post correctly?
24 hours. Google aerial shows it as painted "bus only." the street becomes one way for cars at that point. not sure how it is today

there's a former transit only lane both ways on Burlington for about 18 blocks. I heard it was for during the I-35 closing. they converted it over to parking but left the transit signal light up. all the "no parking" signs are there but just blank metal now. so KC has a history of doing them where they have value
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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we have peak-only bus lanes, nothing more. not sure if the 12th street plan requires all-day bus lanes, but I know the proposal for grand does not.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by DaveKCMO »

the final phase of the CSA is nearly complete -- downtown routing. expect big changes and improvements:

- consolidation of north/south routes on grand
- consolidation of east/west routes on 11th/12th to connect with streetcar
- construction of "superstops" along the above corridors
- two new transit centers (replacing 10th & main)
- dedicated lanes and (probably) signal priority, the latter not existing today inside the loop

two public meetings july 17

http://www.kcata.org/maps_schedules/downtown_transit
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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DaveKCMO wrote:the final phase of the CSA is nearly complete -- downtown routing. expect big changes and improvements:

- consolidation of north/south routes on grand
- consolidation of east/west routes on 11th/12th to connect with streetcar
- construction of "superstops" along the above corridors
- two new transit centers (replacing 10th & main)
- dedicated lanes and (probably) signal priority, the latter not existing today inside the loop

two public meetings july 17

http://www.kcata.org/maps_schedules/downtown_transit
So is this pretty much guaranteed to happen or is funding of these changes still in question?


My biggest question is the transition westbound from 11th to 12th across Broadway is going to be a mess.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by flyingember »

KCPowercat wrote:
DaveKCMO wrote:the final phase of the CSA is nearly complete -- downtown routing. expect big changes and improvements:

- consolidation of north/south routes on grand
- consolidation of east/west routes on 11th/12th to connect with streetcar
- construction of "superstops" along the above corridors
- two new transit centers (replacing 10th & main)
- dedicated lanes and (probably) signal priority, the latter not existing today inside the loop

two public meetings july 17

http://www.kcata.org/maps_schedules/downtown_transit
So is this pretty much guaranteed to happen or is funding of these changes still in question?

My biggest question is the transition westbound from 11th to 12th across Broadway is going to be a mess.
I would hope it's happening, you can't promote transit with the spaghetti mess the kcata has right now. I'm really good at reading maps and that thing makes me go cross-eyed


the only part that seems off is they should make it so that -every- N-S route hits the transit centers at both ends of downtown, same for E-W. that no line stops before it reaches both of it's transit centers.

if you look carefully, that's not quite the case with this plan and it adds unnecessarily complexity.
http://www.kcata.org/documents/uploads/ ... nStMAX.pdf

this would do something simple for every rider. lets say you're coming from Vivion and N. Oak, off the top of my head 142 stops around Crown Center, you could transfer to at 3rd/Grand N-S line that goes down to Broadway and 31st or you could trasnsfer to an E-W line at 11th, or a different line at Union Station.

the other part is this decreases service to much of downtown. there's multiple streets completely without through service at downtown. the #1 line is a good model to fix this as demand grows

This model would work around the city. I recall the Houston Light Rail will connect to something like 6-9 different transit centers when the current 5-line plan is built.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by DaveKCMO »

KCPowercat wrote:So is this pretty much guaranteed to happen or is funding of these changes still in question?
not guaranteed yet, but planning will proceed. funding is a mix of locally-programmed federal (STP), phase 2 TDD, and amendment 7 funding. complicating things is a federally-funded bike lane on grand that parks has been bumbling around with since the "making grand grand" project fizzled.

KCATA could possibly sell 10th & main, or offer it for redevelopment like they're planning to do with 3rd & grand. both of those might provide some additional revenue.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by mykn »

DaveKCMO wrote:
KCPowercat wrote:So is this pretty much guaranteed to happen or is funding of these changes still in question?
not guaranteed yet, but planning will proceed. funding is a mix of locally-programmed federal (STP), phase 2 TDD, and amendment 7 funding. complicating things is a federally-funded bike lane on grand that parks has been bumbling around with since the "making grand grand" project fizzled.

KCATA could possibly sell 10th & main, or offer it for redevelopment like they're planning to do with 3rd & grand. both of those might provide some additional revenue.
This was months and months ago, but I remember overhearing the idea of a "little library" associated with the public library going in where 10th and Main is. It would essentially be a book drop-off/pick-up w/ a book store. No idea if it's just talk or if there's anything behind it, would be a cool idea though. Personally, I want a park.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by TheBigChuckbowski »

flyingember wrote: the other part is this decreases service to much of downtown. there's multiple streets completely without through service at downtown. the #1 line is a good model to fix this as demand grows
I don't get why the #1 isn't a loop that serves the east side of downtown, as well. There's no N-S line through the east side that doesn't stop at 11th/12th and head west.

The jog over to Wyandotte makes no sense to me, either.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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TheBigChuckbowski wrote:
flyingember wrote: the other part is this decreases service to much of downtown. there's multiple streets completely without through service at downtown. the #1 line is a good model to fix this as demand grows
I don't get why the #1 isn't a loop that serves the east side of downtown, as well. There's no N-S line through the east side that doesn't stop at 11th/12th and head west.

The jog over to Wyandotte makes no sense to me, either.
They are looking for input. The Wyandotte jog has been sent to them via Twitter. I agree that doesn't make sense.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

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KCPowercat wrote:They are looking for input. The Wyandotte jog has been sent to them via Twitter. I agree that doesn't make sense.
i also recommended straightening the route to just run on broadway. there isn't much room on wyandotte through the crossroads anyway.
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by kboish »

So if you look on the proposed maps- it looks like they are planning 4 main transit centers downtown to replace 10th and main- one at 12th and Pennsylvania (West Loop), one at 11thish and Holmes (East Loop), the river market/3rd and grand, and Union Station. I wonder what type of stations they plan to build at these transit centers?
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by DaveKCMO »

next public meeting on downtown routing is feb. 11: http://www.kcata.org/rider_bulletins/pu ... wn_transit
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by kboish »

Are there any cost estimates for fully removing the Max off of main in the downtown area and moving it to Grand?
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Re: KCATA Comprehensive Service Analysis

Post by DaveKCMO »

kboish wrote:Are there any cost estimates for fully removing the Max off of main in the downtown area and moving it to Grand?
not that i've seen. the superstops they're building could accommodate all of the MAX amenities, AFAIK.
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