KCMO Downtown Streetcar

[KC_JAYHAWK]

Anybody else think this has been a complete cluster fvck on the part of the contractors. For about the 3rd or 4th time, Main street is getting cut up again between 12th and 14th street. It's ridiculous. I don't know why they just didn't close an entire block off at a time and complete it correctly and then move on to the next block. I'm hearing that they didn't level the streets with the tracks, so a huge portion of Main street is going to have to be ripped up again. Ahhh, our tax payer dollars at work. Makes me really wonder if I will vote for an extension.

[smh]

Anybody else think this has been a complete cluster fvck on the part of the contractors. For about the 3rd or 4th time, Main street is getting cut up again between 12th and 14th street. It's ridiculous. I don't know why they just didn't close an entire block off at a time and complete it correctly and then move on to the next block. I'm hearing that they didn't level the streets with the tracks, so a huge portion of Main street is going to have to be ripped up again. Ahhh, our tax payer dollars at work. Makes me really wonder if I will vote for an extension.

Where are you "hearing" that? The plan all along has been to tear up and repave the entire route once construction is complete. I've been fairly pleased with the construction process, especially once they figured out how to keep sidewalks mostly open.

[KC_JAYHAWK]

If that has been the plan all along, then it is a horrible plan. The concrete section being cut out in front of 1kcp place was just recently poured, maybe a few months ago. If they are going to re-cut every section again, that is a huge waste. Most people working and living downtown I've talked to are sick of the construction mess and noise, especially when it seems everything is being done twice or even three times??

[loftguy]

If that has been the plan all along, then it is a horrible plan. The concrete section being cut out in front of 1kcp place was just recently poured, maybe a few months ago. If they are going to re-cut every section again, that is a huge waste. Most people working and living downtown I've talked to are sick of the construction mess and noise, especially when it seems everything is being done twice or even three times??

The multiple tearups have been the result of utilities operating independently to replace their infrastructure. There are no laws/ordinances in place to force them to do this in a coordinated fashion and frankly that is a huge task that needs to be addressed. It would be easier on the public and it should make the costs to the utilities lower too. The coordinated street opening subject needs to be made vocal to the utilities, the politicos and bureaucracy. It's now clear to them too, they just need to know it's the priority of the people.

However, that has to happen separate from the task of getting an expedited streetcar deployment in place.

You have to remember, we now have improvements to water/sewer/gas/electricity/communications along the streetcar route that have been deferred for 50 to 100+ years. For 18 months of headaches, we are getting some serious upgrades that are invaluable.

[KC_JAYHAWK]

Gotcha....yeah, hopefully when this thing gets expanded to the Plaza, they can do a better job of coordinating this stuff with the utilities. People that aren't in the loop so to speak, like myself and most of my co-workers, just watch in disgust as a perfectly good section of main street in front of our building gets cut up again and again and again .

[loftguy]

Gotcha....yeah, hopefully when this thing gets expanded to the Plaza, they can do a better job of coordinating this stuff with the utilities. People that aren't in the loop so to speak, like myself and most of my co-workers, just watch in disgust as a perfectly good section of main street in front of our building gets cut up again and again and again .

Those 'in the loop' are cussing too. Such a waste...

[flyingember]

Gotcha....yeah, hopefully when this thing gets expanded to the Plaza, they can do a better job of coordinating this stuff with the utilities. People that aren't in the loop so to speak, like myself and most of my co-workers, just watch in disgust as a perfectly good section of main street in front of our building gets cut up again and again and again .

1. it's expected to dig at a place again because water is below Telco which is below the foundations.

2.
how? they coordinated two miles of more than one dozen utilities and got it all done within 9 months, all while keeping the street and sidewalks open.

that's EXTREMELY hard to do.

The streetcar work has not been perfect but it's set the standard for how to manage a large multi-party construction project downtown. People can point to it for aspects that have worked well.

Remember, this project is a 3D coordinating maze. You have to not just dig holes
you need stable, flat places for equipment appropriate to the project and to base work from
you have to maintain the stability of utility lines you're not moving
you have to maintain the stability of the surface. remove too much dirt at once and things move
you have to keep streets open with shifting lanes, and all in a manner so busses and heavy construction trucks can navigate the mess.
you have to keep garages open

So even if there were four projects that could go in parallel, there's no way to create the space to work in parallel. For water you have a trench with a digger beside it and driving lanes on both sides. You're not doing shallow MGE work 10 feet to the east because that's where people are driving. So you'll end up digging a similar trench when water finishes up after you move the driving lanes

[DaveKCMO]

Gotcha....yeah, hopefully when this thing gets expanded to the Plaza, they can do a better job of coordinating this stuff with the utilities. People that aren't in the loop so to speak, like myself and most of my co-workers, just watch in disgust as a perfectly good section of main street in front of our building gets cut up again and again and again .

one project can't -- and won't -- fix this problem. sorry.

[loftguy]

Gotcha....yeah, hopefully when this thing gets expanded to the Plaza, they can do a better job of coordinating this stuff with the utilities. People that aren't in the loop so to speak, like myself and most of my co-workers, just watch in disgust as a perfectly good section of main street in front of our building gets cut up again and again and again .

1. it's expected to dig at a place again because water is below Telco which is below the foundations.

2.
how? they coordinated two miles of more than one dozen utilities and got it all done within 9 months, all while keeping the street and sidewalks open.

that's EXTREMELY hard to do.

The streetcar work has not been perfect but it's set the standard for how to manage a large multi-party construction project downtown. People can point to it for aspects that have worked well.

Remember, this project is a 3D coordinating maze. You have to not just dig holes
you need stable, flat places for equipment appropriate to the project and to base work from
you have to maintain the stability of utility lines you're not moving
you have to maintain the stability of the surface. remove too much dirt at once and things move
you have to keep streets open with shifting lanes, and all in a manner so busses and heavy construction trucks can navigate the mess.
you have to keep garages open

So even if there were four projects that could go in parallel, there's no way to create the space to work in parallel. For water you have a trench with a digger beside it and driving lanes on both sides. You're not doing shallow MGE work 10 feet to the east because that's where people are driving. So you'll end up digging a similar trench when water finishes up after you move the driving lanes

Flyingember, this is likely the most informative entry you have posted.

Good going..........

[KC_JAYHAWK]

What they are cutting out on Main in 3-4 different sections is only about a foot deep, so I don't see how it could be for utilities. All utilities would be much further below ground. It's like they are just re-doing what they did 2 months ago. But I get the idea. Maybe it wasn't poured right the first or second time

[KCPowercat]

I think I know the work you are referring to... It is odd... I came up with the idea it was for smart sensors, etc part of the Cisco thing.

[flyingember]

the wifi network work is a trench about a foot wide going from the track slab to the street. it's for connecting the conduit in the slab with sidewalk access boxes at places they didn't dig all the way to the sidewalk. I think that work is already complete.

A utility could be that shallow. Google ran their fiber only about 6" below street level. AT&T has copper that showed up during the track slab digging at multiple locations, they have some really shallow cabling.

It's probably traffic signal work. They have 3-4 locations underway for that work right now and it requires moving that wiring from the old poles to the new poles

[KC_JAYHAWK]

Well I did see one of the road workers over lunch get pissed off at somebody that honked at him. He threw his hat and belt at the car but missed...lol. It took a couple of his co-workers to cool him off. He's probably sick of the construction also...

[flyingember]

Well I did see one of the road workers over lunch get pissed off at somebody that honked at him. He threw his hat and belt at the car but missed...lol. It took a couple of his co-workers to cool him off. He's probably sick of the construction also...

I really don't blame him.

[shinatoo]

Heat makes you crazy. Last time I really lost my shit was after working three straight days in heat like this.

[KCPowercat]

It's a pretty nice road diet if you ask me....makes being a pedestrian so much nicer and it's not like traffic is a problem.

[DaveKCMO]

the work we've been discussing is simple street repair. concrete sections were damaged during utility work and are being replaced.

[flyingember]

9th SB looks like it's done
14th SB has forms up
19th SB is 75% done

So that's 7 stops with major concrete work done and two in the works.

The crosswalk work at Union Station has the outline concrete in.

the mainline cabling is strung but there's hardware to put up for it. The service line still has to go in and then all the wires have to be connected together so the train can switch cables.

[flyingember]

Today there was a lot of sidewalk and curb work in the crossroads.

Stop status
major concrete work complete or better
Delaware
5th/Walnut
7th NB
9th SB
16th SB
16th NB
19th NB

work underway
12th NB (digging was being done this afternoon)
14th SB (the platform has been poured)
19th SB (the connecting concrete is being poured)

That's 10 of 16 stops.

remaining:
3rd/Grand
7th SB
9th NB
12th SB
14th NB
Union Station

[flyingember]

Stop status

major concrete work complete or better
Delaware
5th/Walnut
7th NB
9th SB
14th SB
16th SB
16th NB
19th NB
19th SB

work underway
12th NB (the forms appear to all be in place to pour)
9th NB (street concrete destruction today)

That's 11 of 16 stops.

remaining:
3rd/Grand
7th SB
12th SB
14th NB
Union Station