PittPA on marriage, marital finances, fidelity.

[Maitre D]

We're having a tough time thinking of good wedding songs for our upcoming wedding. We need something for our first dance. I know its supposed to be a song that's personal to you, but we're both pretty cynical, and don't have "our song."

Cynical, huh? 

If you really want to be cynical, check out the expected divorce rate for our generation.  60%.  And, of the other 40%, probably 1/2 of them will be unhappy or stick it out for kids/religious reasons/financial issues.

You've got a 1 in 5 chance of being truly happy.  I would say my married friends/acquaintances are hitting at only slightly higher rates.

"But PPA, that won't be me."  Isn't that what everyone says, Max?  If you don't get a pre-nup, as a male, you're asking for it.

[Maitre D]

Not having a prenup would make people try harder to work out their marriage problems, maybe.

How?

It will make the MAN want to work it out (he faces financial ruin).  But for women, who file 75% of the divorces, there is actually financial gain if she's even slightly unhappy.

Rule: the marriage license is the state's way of ensuring the man pays up if the marriage goes awry.  (Even if she files).  The man needs the pre-nup as a way to neutralize this completely bogus inequity.

[Maitre D]

property division and maintenance/alimony at divorce have nothing to do with gender. 

Baloney.  80% of women marry "up" financially.  Even 150K female attorneys tend to marry 200K male ones.

if the husband goes out and makes $150,000 while the wife doesn't work, the husband shouldn't bitch when he has to pay her alimony.  any man with enough werewithal to make that kind of bank should be aware of what he is getting into...same with women.

You're fucking nuts if you believe that shit. 

Say she cheats on him, and files -  you're saying he owes her alimony?  Come on man.

men are increasingly getting alimony and maintenance as well, but of course in smaller numbers. 

any man who faces "financial ruin" due to his divorce needs to find a new lawyer. 

In "no-fault" divorce cases, 80% of the time the filer is the female.  If she bolts for infidelity or physical abuse, that would be one thing.  But no man should pay her "allowance" just b/c she's unhappy Chriz.

[lock+load]

Do you have any sort of rebuttal to my point tho?  B/c I've seen people close to me get hammered, and it's very eye-opening.

Yes.  I know many people who are happily married.  I find it strange that you do not.  You can't live your life based on statistics.

[lock+load]

Whoa.  Why not?  I base many of my decisions on probability.  If there's a 75% chance of failure, shouldn't you be a bit scared?

Because statistics are not a good indicator of how any individual marriage will turn out.  Many marriages are destined for failure from the start.  Take those out, and the statistics look better.

Even if it is a 25% chance at success, you're throwing away a one ion four shot at something great.  For what?

[KCMax]

I think I read somewhere that a disproportionate amount of people account for much of the divorce rate. Elizabeth Taylor and Larry King, as examples.

[Maitre D]

edited

remove this thread.  I'm raising very legit issues (certainly as legit as someone asking for wedidng song advice), so knock off the stupidity.

edited

[kcdcchef]

Hey dumb fuck mod -

remove this thread.  I'm raising very legit issues (certainly as legit as someone asking for wedidng song advice), so knock off the stupidity.

you are the dumb fuck pp'ass. you are so goddamned ignorant, to go into a thread where someone asks advice on a wedding song, and to discuss divorce, man, you are one heartless piece of shit.

please, go play with some gasoline and matches in the freeway. please.

[lock+load]

you are the dumb fuck pp'ass. you are so goddamned ignorant, to go into a thread where someone asks advice on a wedding song, and to discuss divorce, man, you are one heartless piece of shit.

please, go play with some gasoline and matches in the freeway. please.

Do you have something to add?  If not, stay away.  You spew your vile crap on all sorts of threads.

[Maitre D]

you are the dumb fuck pp'ass. you are so goddamned ignorant, to go into a thread where someone asks advice on a wedding song, and to discuss divorce, man, you are one heartless piece of shit.

Have you been divorced yet?

please, go play with some gasoline and matches in the freeway. please.

Why?  You don't want to lose potential customers to cook for, do you?

Who the hell do you think pays your salary?

[chrizow]

ooooo! 

not only did i split my first topic tonight - it looks like i may get to Dumpster-ize my first topic as well.

[kcdcchef]

Who the hell do you think pays your salary?

not trailer trash like you, pp'ass

[lock+load]

ooooo! 

not only did i split my first topic tonight - it looks like i may get to Dumpster-ize my first topic as well.

How about we dumpsterize the chef crap. 

[Maitre D]

ooooo! 

not only did i split my first topic tonight - it looks like i may get to Dumpster-ize my first topic as well.

You know what, when i typed the original message, I had a feeling people would take it the wrong way, or assume I'm trying to bash traditional marriage.

That's simply untrue.  It's vital in the case of people wanting to raise children - and great for those that truly are committed.

However, this is a HUGE topic for 20-40 yr old people.  And, since this board is almost exclusively MALE, they should talk about MALE issues in life.  

Maybe it's b/c I live in the land of well-off divorcees (a.k.a, Johnson County).....but i've seen some absurd crap that makes me question if marriage - for URBANITES - makes a god damn bit of sense any more.  Is it outdated?

[kcdcchef]

edited

if anyone wants to know what you said before you edited it,


Quote from: pittsburghparoyal on Today at 11:44:41 PM
Hey dumb fuck mod -

remove this thread.  I'm raising very legit issues (certainly as legit as someone asking for wedidng song advice), so knock off the stupidity.

be a man, little dude.

[chrizow]

How about we dumpsterize the chef crap. 

i don't approve of anyone's shenanigans.

You know what, when i typed the original message, I had a feeling people would take it the wrong way, or assume I'm trying to bash traditional marriage.

That's simply untrue.  It's vital in the case of people wanting to raise children - and great for those that truly are committed.

However, this is a HUGE topic for 20-40 yr old people.  And, since this board is almost exclusively MALE, they should talk about MALE issues in life. 

Maybe it's b/c I live in the land of well-off divorcees (a.k.a, Johnson County).....but i've seen some absurd crap that makes me question if marriage - for URBANITES - makes a god damn bit of sense any more.  Is it outdated?

it is an important issue. 

my $.02 is that FAR fewer people should be getting married.  people are fully capable of raising families and being monogamous in non-marital relationships.  i think far too many people impulsively get married, impulsively have kids, then impulsively (but tortuously) get divorced. 

tips:
1.  if you think it's time to get married to your S.O., wait a year.
2.  if you think you want to be committed to your S.O. forever, consider civil unions or simply just being together forever.  you open a giant can of legal/equitable worms by getting married. 

[Maitre D]

it is an important issue. 

my $.02 is that FAR fewer people should be getting married.  people are fully capable of raising families and being monogamous in non-marital relationships.  i think far too many people impulsively get married, impulsively have kids, then impulsively (but tortuously) get divorced.  .  if you think you want to be committed to your S.O. forever, consider civil unions or simply just being together forever.  you open a giant can of legal/equitable worms by getting married. 

Amen brother.  I tell deeply religious people I know, that I see no reason to marry if you don't want children.  you can live together and be committed, or go civil union.  They look at me in horror.  And that's the point!  People in society demand marriage, or you're weird if you question it. 

I've had g.f. who tried to pressure me into it, and their moms acted like I was a convicted felon if I didn't submit to their wishes.

Well, for a male, he BETTER quesiton it.  B/c a majority of the time, she ends it and the bills do NOT end.

[chrizow]

1.  keep in mind that statistics regarding marriage (who files more often, etc) are wildly misleading. 
2.  impulsive marriage can have dire consequences for both sexes and all financial arrangements.  it's not a "male" and "money" issue exclusively. 
3.  anyone considering marriage should really think hard about what she/he is getting into.  are you getting married because you like the idea of "being married" or "being married to a doctor" or "being married to a hottie?"  take a hard look at yourself and that other person and ask yourself if there is a more than 2% chance you won't be in love with her in 5-10 years.  if the answer is yes, walk - nay, run - away.

[chrizow]

Amen brother.  I tell deeply religious people I know, that I see no reason to marry if you don't want children.  you can live together and be committed, or go civil union.  They look at me in horror.  And that's the point!  People in society demand marriage, or you're weird if you question it. 

I've had g.f. who tried to pressure me into it, and their moms acted like I was a convicted felon if I didn't submit to their wishes.

luckily i only attract females of the leftist/feminist/a-religious persuasion, who would not dream of permitting me to brand them with the Grand Phallic Symbol of marriage.  my soul and my bank account shall remain happy.

[Maitre D]

The reason I bring this up is, every gal I dated after 18 incessantly droned on (and in many cases, pressured) for marriage.  And for guys (ones I know), most of us could take it or leave it.  No guy worries about his "clock" or what society will think of him if he's single.

this has a huge impact on development.  Since only 54% or whatever, of homes are headed by married couples vs. the 70% of yesteryear....our society is vastly different!  This means more people are possible urban dwellers - vs. suburbanites.

Lesser family sizes...more condos probably.....the further decline of rural America (where marriage tends to be more popular even, than cities).....etc.