P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby Highlander » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:40 pm

I saw the Star article. I wonder how they are going to get around trademark infringement with the County Line BBQ restaurants out of Austin. Sounds like a major point of confusion and diluting the name of their brand (like when it was OK Joes - relatives from Oklahoma swore to me that it was a franchise from OKC).

That said, it should be a great addition although I wish it was replacing any number of not-so-great places in the P&L District and not Gordon Biersch which I kind of liked.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby shinatoo » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:50 pm

So does the county line name come from the original Okey Joes being on the Wyandotte county line in Kansas? Kind of a weird naming plan that guy has.
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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby KCLofts » Fri Aug 18, 2017 3:44 pm

shinatoo wrote:So does the county line name come from the original Okey Joes being on the Wyandotte county line in Kansas? Kind of a weird naming plan that guy has.


Yes, according to the BizJournal article.

The name "County Line" is a nod to Joe's Kansas City's roots in Kansas City, Kan., where its first area location sits along Mission Road and County Line Road.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby beautyfromashes » Fri Aug 18, 2017 3:58 pm

Have to respect Joes for stepping up to represent good BBQ in the heart of the city. Gates, Bryant's and Jack Stack missed an opportunity.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby NorthOak » Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:08 pm

The name "County Line" is a nod to Joe's Kansas City's roots in Kansas City, Kan., where its first area location sits along Mission Road and County Line Road.


Maybe someone should remind Dumbf__ Dorothy that he's not in kansas anymore.
His bbq slathered-in-cheese sammich should be a big hit with the douchters in P&L.
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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby Highlander » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:09 pm

KCLofts wrote:
shinatoo wrote:So does the county line name come from the original Okey Joes being on the Wyandotte county line in Kansas? Kind of a weird naming plan that guy has.


Yes, according to the BizJournal article.

The name "County Line" is a nod to Joe's Kansas City's roots in Kansas City, Kan., where its first area location sits along Mission Road and County Line Road.


I kind of thought the name was from the location in KCK on County Line Road. But there is another bbq chain with the a very similar name - which was at one time more represented around the US than it is now.

http://www.countyline.com/

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby chingon » Fri Aug 18, 2017 7:42 pm

NorthOak wrote:
The name "County Line" is a nod to Joe's Kansas City's roots in Kansas City, Kan., where its first area location sits along Mission Road and County Line Road.


Maybe someone should remind Dumbf__ Dorothy that he's not in kansas anymore.
His bbq slathered-in-cheese sammich should be a big hit with the douchters in P&L.


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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby StrangerThings » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:53 pm

Over 1000 people were served during the reveal lunch. They polled about 300 of them and asked what was they're favorite item on the menu. The two top answers, the Jalapeño Sausage and the Tacos.

This has been in the works for over 6 months and is backed by people with solid business, food, bar and restaurant credentials. Nothing, including the menu, name, design, logo, server outfits etc are decided upon without hours and weeks of planning.

As for the name and any issues with the texas chain, I'm sure they checked that too. I'll find out.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby KCPowercat » Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:11 pm

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby DaveKCMO » Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:05 am

all this hubbub! i just want mixx to be open nights and weekends.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby StrangerThings » Sat Aug 19, 2017 1:19 pm

DaveKCMO wrote:all this hubbub! i just want mixx to be open nights and weekends.


So doesn't Cordish. At least until 8 or something.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby DaveKCMO » Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:36 pm

StrangerThings wrote:
DaveKCMO wrote:all this hubbub! i just want mixx to be open nights and weekends.


So doesn't Cordish. At least until 8 or something.


ugh. make it like a mall so all the tenants have minimum hours. clearly there's a case for saturdays, given the newfound crowds.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby KCPowercat » Sat Aug 19, 2017 3:04 pm

That whole mixx block was poorly designed. Only a national chain like Chipotle can really draw and make it.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby StrangerThings » Sat Aug 19, 2017 9:44 pm

KCPowercat wrote:That whole mixx block was poorly designed. Only a national chain like Chipotle can really draw and make it.


I don't think it has anything to do with design. They could have went with a big bland box that favors more national chains but wanted to get a nice water/fire feature in as well as community space for people to eat and relax. They've put a ton of money into it this year restoring the water fall, fire feature and added some much better seating options. It gets actual use during lunch hours these days.

The Mixx has the demand, they just choose to not open. Protein House and Insomnia Cookies are killing it. BK sucks because of piss poor management and Drunken Fish keeps doing well.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby pash » Sat Aug 19, 2017 11:38 pm

.
Last edited by pash on Thu Sep 21, 2017 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby KCPowercat » Sun Aug 20, 2017 12:44 am

Exactly what pash said.

The fountain area would be cool with the right retailers I guess but the current ones aren't right.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby flyingember » Sun Aug 20, 2017 7:54 pm

I tend to avoid it, too hard to get there. The valet parking around it hurts the chances for short term shopper visits.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby StrangerThings » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:52 pm

pash wrote:I'm pretty sure KCPowercat is referring to the fact that none of the storefronts there open onto the street, instead facing into the interior of the block. And most of them are elevated above street level or sunken below it, so if you're walking along Main, Walnut, or 14th, it's easy to walk by without even really noticing that there's much there.

The block is very poorly designed, from the standpoint of any conventional urban-planning playbook of the present era, and indeed it feels more like an open-air version of a shopping mall than it does a city street in a shopping district. You have to choose to leave the street and go into the interior of the P&L "block" even to see what's there. I walk by a lot, but almost never go into the block, unless it's a shortcut to where I'm going, in the same way that I probably wouldn't walk into the entrance of an urban shopping mall (yes, there is such a thing) unless I was already intending to go to a particular establishment inside it, even if I might otherwise tend to wander into some of the same establishments if I walked by them on the street.

The P&L is what it is, and isn't what it isn't. And what it isn't is an urban district that feels urban and works like 99.9% of the successful urban districts in the world work.


The original concept leaned a bit too heavily on a key factor. H&R employees. You'll notice the nice fancy stairs that lead down from the H&R tower into the fountain area, much like a food court concept. Turns out H&R employees don't use it nearly as much as they had planned for. Between pressure from the city to have a water feature and community area, working around varying elevations and a parking garage below that required a elevator to be placed within this space, it was what it was. Respectfully, I just don't buy the "opps, didn't see it and walked on by" excuse. Signage exist for this very reason. If there's a quality establishment within that block with quality product, people will have no problem finding it. Some of us are desensitized to our urban surroundings considering we walk past these things all the time.

I don't think you can claim the entire district doesn't work like 99.9% of "successful" urban districts. Considering it is successful and partially responsible for downtowns total revitalization along with many other things. The other districts I've had a part in, some currently under construction have similarities to this district. Texas Live. District Detroit. Waterside Live. Xfinity Live. To name a few. I don't think the concepts would continue to be approved if they've failed or were of poor urban design.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby StrangerThings » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:54 pm

With that said, taste will vary.

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Re: P&L District: 13th & Walnut Site Proposal

Postby KCPowercat » Mon Aug 21, 2017 8:52 am

"I don't think the concepts would continue to be approved if they've failed or were of poor urban design."

Let's just discuss without you thinking everytime a negative p&l comment is some sort of personal attack. That's what we do here. There is no doubt that area could have been better designed...but hindsight is 20/20...we all get that.

Concepts like Texas live being approved has nothing to do with good urban planning.


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