Fixing p&l traffic backups

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kas1
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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by kas1 » Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:37 pm

horizons82 wrote:
kas1 wrote: Here's archived Street View imagery of a 15 story building under construction on a corner: https://www.google.com.ar/maps/@-34.583 ... 6656?hl=en
Buenos Aires is not remotely comparable to the US in terms of building code and OSHA requirements. Show me a project in Nashville, Chicago, etc, and I'm all ears. Otherwise you're talking about an overhaul of state and federal safety regs, good luck with that...
kas1 wrote: And for that matter, cranes can be installed within the footprint of a building itself: https://www.google.com.ar/maps/@40.7532 ... 6656?hl=en
Now this is more possible, but as you can see they're still taking over sidewalk and street space.
I'm speaking more broadly than just this one project. I've lurked here a long time and seen countless complaints about sidewalks being closed for years at a time for simple projects such as building renovations. It seems clear to me that Kansas City lacks either the desire or the institutional know-how to minimize the effects of construction on the public ROW. The example I posted from NY is a larger building than Two Light yet it intrudes no more into the public ROW than Two Light does despite part of the intrusion into the street being used for pedestrian circulation. If it didn't provide space for pedestrians, as Two Light doesn't, then it would clearly intrude less. But contractors in Kansas City won't ever have any incentive to improve if the attitude from the public is that it's just part of life.

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KCPowercat
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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by KCPowercat » Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:45 pm

Exactly.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by horizons82 » Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:49 pm

Kas1, you know there's already an ordinance for maintaining pedestrian access moving forward, right? Two light was grandfathered out but with three light they'll have to maintain access. I'm glad that ordinance is there, like KCPowercat said, accessibility is important.

Two light could not be built like that tower in NYC, as StrangerThings said. If you want a smaller construction perimeter like that, you need to attack parking needs in the city, not construction of towers. I get that you're not talking about Two Light specifically; but for any structure that needs a poured concrete base, the same crane condition is going to occur for structural and safety reasons 9 out of 10 times. Should it go on the N/S streets instead of Truman? Truman has more capacity to sacrifice.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by KCPowercat » Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:08 pm

that ordinance to maintain pedestrian access is still on a big learning curve....report it anytime you see it not occurring.

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TheLastGentleman
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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by TheLastGentleman » Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:43 pm

StrangerThings wrote:How about the structural work being done to the Andrews McNeil building?! Slowest project ever and has caused some issues. At least they now have scaffolding in place so the sidewalks are available. I feel terrible for the guy who leased the space across the street to put in a picklemans. I really hope he’s not having to pay.
Are you talking about the old Boley building? Collison did an article saying work on it was finally being wrapped up

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by TheLastGentleman » Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:44 pm


WoodDraw
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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by WoodDraw » Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:17 pm

The problem isn't really cordish, but the city being actively awful at enforcing codes. I don't blame developers for taking the cheapest way out.

I've complained for a year about the old federal reserve being a rat and pigeon infested shit hole. Nothing ever happens.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by tower » Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:55 pm

KCPowercat wrote:Demanding better out of our quality of life...yes even during construction...isn't comical. It should be our standard that every construction project respects the already existing environment. If a company doesn't respect that lets get someone in here that does.

I just got back from New York and walked through numerous construction site of buildings 3 times the size of two light...and didnt have to cross the street due to closed sidewalks...it's not hard.
If it is a larger, more expensive building, they can attach cranes to the top, or use an internal tower crane that "hops" to a new platform every couple of floors. An external tower crane will take up the sidewalk and a lane of road, regardless of the building size. Both of the other methods are unnecessary in this case and would add to the cost. If the city doesn't care about the closures, the for-profit company building it won't, for damn sure.

Article about NYC cranes here: http://www.slate.com/articles/life/expl ... pers_.html

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by WoodDraw » Sat Jan 20, 2018 10:54 pm

I mean let's talk about the elephant in the room too. Cordish got a sweetheart development deal way back when and things haven't always been lovely between downtown and cordish. I think they have the reputation for thinking they can do whatever they want to and people should just be happy they're around. Anyway, too much criticism of them is answered with "well back back when they first started..." whether that's still true can be debated.

Blah blah blah.

I don't have any problem holding one of our most important landowners to a high standard. I won't get out the pitchforks for much said here, but they do always have an excuse for doing nothing.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by shinatoo » Sun Jan 21, 2018 10:09 am

StrangerThings wrote:
WoodDraw wrote:I mean let's talk about the elephant in the room too. Cordish got a sweetheart development deal way back when and things haven't always been lovely between downtown and cordish. I think they have the reputation for thinking they can do whatever they want to and people should just be happy they're around. Anyway, too much criticism of them is answered with "well back back when they first started..." whether that's still true can be debated.

Blah blah blah.

I don't have any problem holding one of our most important landowners to a high standard. I won't get out the pitchforks for much said here, but they do always have an excuse for doing nothing.
As someone who has been around from day 1, I can say that the relationship between the city and Cordish is pretty great. Sure, the city pushes back on some topics as they should but Cordish isn’t a corner cutting do the minimum type of company.

Certainly don’t have the attitude they can do anything they want to. Every decision made is with the city in mind. It’s not lost on them that they got a good deal. However it’s also not like Cordish is just making a pile of money and running off to the bank. Every penny spent is a long term investment into downtowns future. I’d assume Cordish is the biggest stake holder in the success or failure in the future of downtown.

I am curious what anyone thinks they’ve not done and what excuses have been made?
The citizens of Kansas City, present and future, are the biggest stakeholders in the success or failure downtown.
Quocunque Jeceris Stabit

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by KCPowercat » Sun Jan 21, 2018 10:24 am

Exactly. Let's steer back to traffic.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by tower » Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:18 pm

We should ban cars traveling on main for more than a block, like in Toronto. We couldn't design the street so that they would be forced off, like they did, but at the bare minimum, it might stop google maps from routing people down main.

Then once people have gotten used to using other side streets, pedestrianize every section of main without a garage opening, then eventually, as garages and lots go away, we will have a pedestrian and transit only street.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by KCPowercat » Sun Jan 21, 2018 12:54 pm

I and others I know have edited google maps to suggest making it the not preferred street in it's routing. Not sure if it stuck.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by tower » Sun Jan 21, 2018 1:18 pm

Image

Probably not. Either way, forcing cars to turn off after one block would still be a good idea. Toronto boosted travel times by 20-24% and boosted ridership by 25%.

We would have to force cars to turn left off main at most intersections, rather than turn right, but it would probably have the same effect to have right turn on/left turn off rather than right turn on/right turn off. Some intersections they could choose, because we already have right turn lanes.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by KCPowercat » Sun Jan 21, 2018 2:01 pm

Did it from OPKS and to downtown destinations and never went down main.

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by hgascoigne » Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:30 pm

Looking out my window tonight reminded me of this thread. So much going on here: A long line of cars attempting to get into the Midland garage (from both directions so both directions are blocked), cars blocking the intersection at 12th street, and the streetcar has take 15 minutes to navigate one block. It’s also alarming how long it takes each car to pass through the entrance of the garage. I’ve never used that garage so I’m not sure what causes the slowdown in there.

I know that we all are aware of this, but it was kind of funny to see it all in action at once.

Image

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by Chris Stritzel » Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:01 pm

hgascoigne wrote:Looking out my window tonight reminded me of this thread. So much going on here: A long line of cars attempting to get into the Midland garage (from both directions so both directions are blocked), cars blocking the intersection at 12th street, and the streetcar has take 15 minutes to navigate one block. It’s also alarming how long it takes each car to pass through the entrance of the garage. I’ve never used that garage so I’m not sure what causes the slowdown in there.

I know that we all are aware of this, but it was kind of funny to see it all in action at once.

Image
The line of people trying to get into the Midland could be a hint why so many people were down there tonight and thus causing traffic to backup. Good sign!

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by DaveKCMO » Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:29 pm

A few things:

1) They just changed to credit cards only and the transaction time is slow.
2) One lane in on event nights.
3) Garage access from Baltimore apparently doesn't provide an easy path to Main Street (garage layout is like a "double helix", I'm told... whatever that means).

The city is working with Executive Hills to remedy this, which clearly did not consider streetcar operations. Bollard preventing some turn movements into the garage are not out of the question.

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grovester
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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by grovester » Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:00 pm

SF parking garages were unfettered entrance, pay at a central kiosk in the garage, then submit ticket into reader at exit.

Why is this not possible in KC?

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Re: Fixing p&l traffic backups

Post by KCPowercat » Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:10 pm

It can be done. That's actually a mode of operation at Cordish garages but nobody uses it very much.

Seems like in this specific situation.... I've went by Baltimore entrance a couple times recently and not sure it's the right answer in addition to what Dave says that it doesn't sound like building management will think it will work on the inside.

They've got to at least stop left turning from the south....and find a new way to take money from parkers. What's happening now is ridiculous.

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