2011 Chiefs

[AllThingsKC]

I don't exactly SEE* the reason... (I can't edit posts on the sucky mobile version)

[phuqueue]

It's true that the Chiefs are grappling with injuries this year, but doesn't Haley arguably bear some of the blame for that? Injuries are a fact of life in the NFL but it's a little unusual for marquee players to drop one after another before the season begins and in the first couple weeks. Haley's response to the lockout, easing the team into training camp as he did might be responsible for the players not being properly conditioned and in shape for the season. We clearly weren't ready for the season in our final preseason games, when our starters got beaten by Green Bay's backups. While the Bills and Lions were both "surprise" teams this year, they obviously aren't as good as they looked in crushing the Chiefs in the first two weeks. In week 3 we found our footing and nearly beat a Chargers team that's in a down year but on paper at least looks much better than the Bills and Lions teams that blew us out. Finally rolled off four wins, albeit mostly against bad teams. For sure, when we were 4-3, it looked a lot like we just weren't ready to play for real until three or four weeks into the season. Since then we've lost to good and bad teams alike, but of course we've done so with a depleted roster.

People are pinning a lot of this on Pioli for not having accumulated enough depth, and I definitely think that's fair to a point, but the Chiefs have lost a lot of front line players; "depth" can't realistically mean having a whole other first team waiting in the wings. I'm no doctor or strength and conditioning coach or whatever so I don't know how much of the injuries you can pin on Haley's training camp, but it's something that warrants consideration I think. Pioli's responsible for the personnel problems this season to the extent that he could have reasonably assembled a deeper team than he has, Haley's responsible to the extent that he bears any responsibility for the rash of injuries, but otherwise you do just have to chalk some of it up to bad luck.

[KCPowercat]

Tuner Gill firing gets its own thread but the NFL team coach doesn't? Weird.

[knucklehead]

the Chiefs were a young team that was proably hurt more than some others by the lack of an off season program and the short training camp.

Charles and Berry were arguably the offensive and defensive MVP. With Charles, Cassel was the competition for offensvie MVP. With Berry it was Hali or Flowers.

The Chiefs did not sign players to add depth at TE (when Moeki went down all we had was Pope); Running Back (It was clear Jones was not up to a full time load); Safety (John McGraw does not have the foot speed to be a starter) and backup QB (Palko is basically a waiver wire guy).

The question is motivation. There are two possible explanations - they were too cheap to bring in quality backups as free agents; or -- they didn't think they were good enought to win playoff games, looked at the tough schedule, and decided that if things went bad injury wise they would accept the losses to get better draft position.

Gross incompetence is not a credible explanation. Even a grossly incompentent person would have recognized that Palko was not adequate. The grossly incompetent person may not have chosen the right guy to bring in, but they would have done something.

[KCMax]

Rumor is there is a charter flight from NYC (where Bill Cowher does his CBS show) to Kansas City!!!!!!

[KCMax]

Just an outside the box thought, but what about bringing Marty Schottenheimer back? He's the most successful coach we've had since Hank Stramm. He's only 68, just a bit older than Giants coach Tom Coughlin. You may say "he's been out of the game too long," but his last year of coaching in the NFL was 2007 - same year as Bill Cowher who is coveted.

Probably wouldn't happen under Pioli, but I always loved Marty's style of play, and he adjusted as the league became more pass-happy in his time with the Chargers. And hey, bringing back an older, beloved coach worked for K-State, right?

[mean]

I don't think he'd do it, but I'd honestly rather have Marty than Mangini or McDaniels--the two guys I fear Pioli is probably speed-dialing like mad right now.

[phuqueue]

I'd take Marty in a heartbeat over anyone off the Belichick coaching tree

[AllThingsKC]

One of these things is not like the others.
One of these things just doesn't belong.
Can you tell me which thing is not like the others
now before I finish my song?

[knucklehead]

CBS had an important blurb regarding free agency.

First, 25 percent of the players in the league are currently scheduled to be free agents next year, a record number.

Second, the teams have been told too expect little to no increase in the salary cap next year. Charlly Casserley said too expect free agency "carnage" next year as many teams are in very bad salary cap position. In 2013 the cap is going up substantially as the new TV contracts kick in.

This may be the year when Clark Hunt pulls out the check book, as it sounds like there may be some decent deals available.

For those of you wondering about Cassell's contract, it averages 10.5 million a year but was front loaded. In 2012, Cassell's salary is only $5.5 million. Makes you wonder if the Chiefs could afford Cassell and Orten both (assuming Orton can be signed for under $10 million a year).

[KCMax]

If Orton plays well, someone will likely sign him to start. I still say start Cassel next year, but draft a QB in the first two rounds and groom him to be the future. Orton has been thoroughly mediocre his entire career. He's not much of an improvement over Cassel.

Great win though. Romeo has me on his bandwagon. Players clearly love him and he has done wonders with this defense.

[mean]

I almost hate to say this, but at this point I'd stick with Orton. I've been very pro-Cassel since he got signed, but what Orton showed me yesterday is that he may be better than Cassel. He appears to have a better arm, better vision, better decision-making, and he seems to be more accurate. Granted, maybe yesterday's performance was a fluke. It's true that the Packers have a terrible defense, although the fact that not a single pass (as far as I can recall) went sailing over the head of a receiver is encouraging. And the dropped pass that Orton threaded into double coverage that could have been a touchdown? I don't think I'd trust Cassel to try that. Oops, overthrown and tipped, LOL INTERCEPTION IN THE END ZONE!

[KCMax]

That's fine, but is Orton really the future long-term? I guess I really don't care one way or the other whether its Cassel or Orton, so long as neither is the starting QB by 2013.

Regardless, I have a hard time seeing Pioli eating the money and cutting his New England boy in favor or Orton.

[mean]

I doubt Orton or Cassel are the answer long-term. Frankly, I think they're both probably solid backups. However, if I'm Pioli I at least give Orton a fair shot. He looked sharp while throwing for 300 yards, and Cassel didn't really do either all year. I don't know that Pioli would do that, since benching Cassel is tantamount to admitting a mistake, but that's what I'd do.

If there's a viable franchise type guy available in the first round of the draft, maybe I go that way if I'm Pioli, but drafting a QB in the first round is risky. Andrew Luck could turn out to be Peyton Manning or Ryan Leaf, but he'll get a giant payday either way. I seriously doubt Pioli goes that route, and I'm not sure I would either.

[KCMax]

In the new CBA, I think they curtailed huge paydays for first round picks. Its a huge risk, but its a risk worth taking. I don't think Orton will lead a team to a Super Bowl.

[mean]

Let's say Orton plays well and the Chiefs win the next couple games. Maybe the Chiefs even win the division and (gasp) perhaps they even win a playoff game. They did just beat the last remaining undefeated team and defending Super Bowl champs, after all, so I think those two things are entirely possible (if not extremely likely). Do you extend Orton?

[KCFutbol]

I almost hate to say this, but at this point I'd stick with Orton. I've been very pro-Cassel since he got signed, but what Orton showed me yesterday is that he may be better than Cassel. He appears to have a better arm, better vision, better decision-making, and he seems to be more accurate. Granted, maybe yesterday's performance was a fluke. It's true that the Packers have a terrible defense, although the fact that not a single pass (as far as I can recall) went sailing over the head of a receiver is encouraging. And the dropped pass that Orton threaded into double coverage that could have been a touchdown? I don't think I'd trust Cassel to try that. Oops, overthrown and tipped, LOL INTERCEPTION IN THE END ZONE!

I'm primarilly a Bears fan, born in Chicago. I suffered through the inconsistancies of Kyle Orton when he was the Bears QB. He can be pretty darn good, as he was yeasterday or frustratingly poor.

At this point I think he can be a decent backup but I wouldn't peg him a the long-term solution. That said, I'd rather see him as the current Bears QB than Caleb Hannie.

As a Bears/Chiefs fan it's great to see Green Bay lose, just like as a Cubs/Royals fan it's great to see the Cardinals lose.

[KCMax]

Let's say Orton plays well and the Chiefs win the next couple games. Maybe the Chiefs even win the division and (gasp) perhaps they even win a playoff game. They did just beat the last remaining undefeated team and defending Super Bowl champs, after all, so I think those two things are entirely possible (if not extremely likely). Do you extend Orton?

No. Cassel did all those things too - beat the defending Super Bowl champs (2009 Steelers), won a division - except win the playoff game. I just don't see that big a difference between the two. Orton has a better arm, but he has no touch. Cassel has great touch, but not much of an arm. Both have been in the league for many years and have never carried their team past the first round of the playoffs. Keeping either of them around would be like the Dave Krieg years under Marty.

[pash]

.

[KCMax]

It was explained to me that all we need to do is win out, have Buffalo beat Denver, and have San Diego lose at least one of their remaining games.