Star compares KU, MU, KSU fans

[MoMan]

As far as hicks.  Kansas people calling Missouri people hicks is hilarious.  

Especially when the person throwing the "hick" label at Kansas Citians and St. Louisans is from Topeka, Kansas.

[KC-wildcat]

What I was pointing out was how I see so many MU fans rooting against KU rather than rooting for MU.  I suppose KU fans would do the same thing though if the roles were reversed, and MU dominated us year in, year out.

KU fans root against KSU and MU all the time.  I observed and listened to a number of KU fans openly rooting against KSU during the CU game at the Big XII tourny.  I was there in person.  I mean, it certainly wasn't the CU fans because, as we all know, the only CU fans at the tourny were friends and family of the program.    

Granted, most of these "KU fan" jackasses were of the huge contingency of highly vocal, NASCAR jacket wearing, face painted, non-KU graduate morons that travel to every sporting event and talk shit on everybody not wearing a Brady Morningstar button on their carharts.

Which, to bring it full circle, probably explains the salary figures cited by the Star.  KU has a mass following of unaffiliated people who didn't attend college.  If polled, the throngs of semi-morons would claim their favorite teams as the Chiefs, Jayhawk Basketball, and Dale Jr.  We've all been to the Big XII tourny.  Don't even attempt to deny what I'm talking about.    

[chrizow]

Midwestern college fans (regardless of state) are all the same food group .

Kansas is just a bit more obsessed with college sports IMO while Missouri is more take it or leave it.  People pull for MU and support the teams, but it sort of takes a back seat to the pro teams and other interests (I say this from a KC and StL perspective)  I have always said that and will never back down from it.  College sports defines places like Kansas, Iowa, Nebraska etc.  I don't think that's the case at all in MO and if even less the case in places like Colorado, Minnesota etc where college sports are popular and their are plenty of fans, but it's not all consuming and obsessive as if that's the only thing there is to do there.  Live in StLouis or Denver for a while and you would see how far down college sports are in most people lives compared to KC area residents (especially KS side KC area residents).

my anecdotal, but nonetheless accurate assessment as a two-time MU grad and lifetime MO resident:

the eastern 50% of Missouri (if not 2/3) is STL Cardinals territory, period.  

the western half of Missouri is Chiefs country.  the KC metro side of MO is Chiefs/Royals territory first, MU a distant second.  (i would even argue that given the large number of UCM, NWMS, Mo State, etc. grads in Missouri, a lot of folks on the MO side may root for KU because often grads from other MO schools do not like MU for whatever reason.  Mo Staters are actively hostile since it is second fiddle to MU in the state.)

STL metro allegiance is Cardinals, Rams, Blues, with colleges like MU, SLU, and Illinois way down the list.

By contrast, the state of Kansas seems to be pretty evenly divided between KU and KSU, with all pro sports well below KU/KSU (as there are no pro sports in the state).  This seems particularly true in JoCo, which is  absolutely permeated with all things KU and given the critical mass of Jayhawks there, the obsession echo chamber is inescapable.

[GRID]

my anecdotal, but nonetheless accurate assessment as a two-time MU grad and lifetime MO resident:

the eastern 50% of Missouri (if not 2/3) is STL Cardinals territory, period.  

the western half of Missouri is Chiefs country.  the KC metro side of MO is Chiefs/Royals territory first, MU (or even KU) a distant second.

STL metro allegiance is Cardinals, Rams, Blues, with colleges like MU, SLU, and Illinois way down the list.

By contrast, the state of Kansas seems to be pretty evenly divided between KU and KSU, with all pro sports well below KU/KSU (as there are no pro sports in the state).  This seems particularly true in JoCo, which is  absolutely permeated with all things KU and given the critical mass of Jayhawks there, the obsession echo chamber is inescapable.

I think that's what I was trying to say

[NDTeve]

All good points. Grid, you left out the SEC which is arguably much more obsessed with college teams than the Big 12 (KU, KSU, etc).

[chingon]

I'll take your anecdotes at face value when you speak to your experience at MU and in metro KC. However, as someone who is from actual Kansas, I would ask that you consider these 2 corrections:

By contrast, the state of Kansas seems to be pretty evenly divided between KU and KSU, with all pro sports well below KU/KSU (as there are no pro sports in the state).

Eastern Kansas certainly (and likely the sum total of all of Kansas) places Chiefs football on par or above KU basketball and K-State football. Because it's the NFL. And to the extent that the Royals have any fanbase, all of Kansas is firmly Royals territory, although I would agree that it carries less cultural weight than KU/KSU.

the KC metro side of MO is Chiefs/Royals territory first, MU a distant second

While that is quite possible true for the MO metro as a whole, the urban core is pretty clearly slanted towards KU-fandom, in no small part since the highest density of college graduates live in the 4th district and the plurality of KC college grads here come from KU.

There are essentially 3 professional sports teams in the metro to follow, depending on which sport your a fan of: the Chiefs, the Royals and KU. Like it or not, KU is one of probably 10 true marquee college basketball programs in the country, and anyone who follows basketball (NBA or college) knows it. Following Kansas basketball (or any college ball for that matter) is akin to following minor league baseball, and while some people might like to pretend that that's what people in Omaha do since they don't have "real sports", a whole host of other people follow minor league baseball because they like the game at many of levels of play. What's more, when it comes to college basketball and football, there are many people who actually think the game is better/more entertaining/more fun/whatever at the college level. Myself included.

The real heart of the MU/KU bullshit is:

1. forgiveably foolish college kids in Lawrence and Columbia and

2. unforgiveable KC suburbanites who use the schools as a proxy for their petty civic views. Most of the obnoxious MU fans I've known are from the MO-side suburbs, the Northland or Outeast. Most of the ludicrous and shitty KU idiocy I've witnessed has been from Johnson Countians.

What people in KCMO consistently fail to recognize is that Johnson county is not Kansas, nor is it representative of Kansans. It is merely a part of Kansas. In fact, it is much more closely aligned with Missouri culturally, economically and geographically. It is a suburb of Missouri, it is Missouri's creation, and it is Missouri's problem.

[chrizow]

While that is quite possible true for the MO metro as a whole, the urban core is pretty clearly slanted towards KU-fandom, in no small part since the highest density of college graduates live in the 4th district and the plurality of KC college grads here come from KU.

this is true - i meant MO-side suburbs/exurbs.  and even there, there are lots of KU fans. 

[GRID]

Having lived in the MO suburbs for six years, I would say it's about 50/50 KU/MU.  It might be 60/40 MU.  But it's close.

Even so, the difference in the fans is still there.  I would say that most MU fans I knew or know in the MO burbs, their interest in MU was below that of the Chiefs and even the Royals.  I don't know why I said "even" the Royals.  It think the Royals are far more popular than the Chiefs, at least in all the circles I ran in.

While most KU fans, it would be KU, then "maybe" the Chiefs and Royals.  But with KU fans, it seems more likely that it would be 90% KU first.  Everything else is a distant second.

[KCMax]

I've only spent a bit of time in Wichita, but it seems like the Chiefs are majorly #1 there, Wichita State basketball is probably #2, followed by in some order KU basketball, K-State basketball and football, Wichita State baseball and Royals baseball.

Also, my impression that while the DC area is focused on pro sports, you don't have to travel far to lose that. Rural Virginia seems to be heavily into Va Tech and Virginia to a lesser degree, or even random ACC teams (mostly Duke or NC). And while DC is into pro sports, it isn't typically the home team (except the Redskins). The big problem with the lack of support for their teams is so many residents are from somewhere else and keep their allegiance, so when you got to a Nats/Mets game, its almost a road game for the Nationals. I imagine that will change if any of those other teams get really good (like the Skins did, and the Caps have for a bit).

In any case, I don't see why it matters that some areas cheer for college sports and others pro sports. Some people prefer college sports over pro sports for the style of play. Or because the feel more affinity to their alma mater than the city they live 30 minutes from. Or because the local nine is lousy and the college sports team is good. Or any number of reasons. People like different things - I hardly see how any value judgment can be made from that.

But I agree, the stereotyping of fans by school is beyond dumb. I've seen dumb KU fans, I am friends with many smart KSU and Mizzou fans. It takes all types. I guess this is the PC way for people to get to make class judgments on one another but its pretty juvenile and speaks volumes about one's own insecurities.

[trailerkid]

Yeah...the Chiefs are/were huge throughout a lot of KS (likely on the same level of popularity as KU/KSU). I think people would also be surprised how many Royals fans (relative) there are west of KC.

[trailerkid]

Especially when the person throwing the "hick" label at Kansas Citians and St. Louisans is from Topeka, Kansas.

How about this...no one in the Midwest sans Chicago has the right to call anyone else a hick.

[GRID]

My assessment of the DC and Baltimore area after nearly 2 years of living here.

First off, a large percent of the people in DC don't care about sports period.  Or at least a far higher percent than what you see in places like KC (or even Baltimore).  Sports (college and pro) are just pretty far down.  It's simply an entertainment option if one feels like partaking.

You very rarely see people wearing any sort of sports clothing etc and when you do, it's usually on trains going to and from the stadiums for games or tourists.

Even though it might be an overall lower percent of the population, there are hundreds of thousands of NFL fans and fans of all sports college and pro.  By shear numbers it's a ton of people, but by percent it's lower.

DC is 80% NFL.  NFL is king.  The skins are huge here, but I would say that at least half the NFL fans are fans of other teams.

Still, NFL is the talk at the office, it's the talk on the friday before the games and monday after etc.  Yet you still don't see the clothing etc.  People just don't do that here.  Although march madness takes hold this time of year.  I would say 20% get into it.  But it's nothing like what I was used to in KC.

I would say MLB is number two.  (not the Nats), everybody here already has a favorite team from wherever they are from and most long time DC fans are Orioles fans.  Although the nats are quickly gaining local fans and "W" (Nationals) ball caps are probably the number one sports related item people wear in DC that is DC related, but other MLB teams (even KC) are just as likely to be seen.  Give the Nats a few more years and they will be a powerhouse just like Philly fans and how the Caps turned around.  It's already happening.  Great stadium and a huge population base when they do become popular.

The Caps are a distant number 3.  Sure they are very popular and I hate dropping $65 a ticket for nosebleed seats.  But as far as the percent of the overall population that gets into them, it's pretty low.  But still a solid number 3 in league support or a 2 in local team support behind the Skins.

Surprisingly, as bad as the Wizards are, they draw pretty well and have a solid following.  But till they turn the team around, it's down way below the caps.

I think college sports falls in around the Wizards.  Maybe below the caps as far as local support.  The University of Maryland, Georgetown, Navy etc.

Again, you have shear numbers of people, plenty enough to support the organizations, but a tiny part of the overall population.

Places like WV and Vtech are more in-line with what you see in the Midwest as far as fan support I think.  But I would guess it's a bit different even there as people bring their Boston or Philly or DC loyalty with them to the schools.  The difference is that once people leave schools, they tend to leave behind the college sports passion to some degree and jump on NFL, MLB fan bases instead, again, if they care at all about sports, where in KC, it's like people are college fans 100% for life like they still go there or something.  You don't see too many 40 something's out here with KU golf shirts and license plates and auto decals and luggage like you do in Johnson County.

After college sports, you have the United of the MLS! haha

Baltimore and Philly are far more into sports than DC (or NYC per capita). Pro sports that is.  You can't go any place in those towns without seeing people wearing MLB and NFL gear.  But rarely do you see college (although PA is very popular).  Boston is nuts on the sox, everything is a distant second thought, but college sports is up much higher there for obvious reasons.

Oh, I forgot, that Baltimore is crazy about the Ravens.  Again, NFL is king out here.  Orioles fans are starting to look like Royals fans.  They are there and Baltimore is a huge MLB town, but the fans have gone into hiding when it comes to showing up at the ballpark.

[KCMax]

  Orioles fans are starting to look like Royals fans.  They are there and Baltimore is a huge MLB town, but the fans have gone into hiding when it comes to showing up at the ballpark.

What a surprise, decades of losing causes a decline in attendance. And here I thought Kansas Citians were unique in being awful fans.

[brewcrew1000]

It seems like the entire east coast is bigger into pro sports then college.  The New York metro probably doesn't care one bit about College Football, i don't even think there is a major college football team in NYC.  Same with Philly.

[GRID]

What a surprise, decades of losing causes a decline in attendance. And here I thought Kansas Citians were unique in being awful fans.

I never said KC had awful baseball fans.  I would say they are some of the best in the country actually.  We have gone to Royals games in many stadiums out here and the amount of Royals fans that show up is really incredible.  I'm not sure any other market (save boston, stl or cubs) would support a team as bad as the royals for a long as KC has and being one of the smallest markets makes KC that much more of a MLB town.  I think KC is much more of an MLB town than an NFL town and now that I live among all these NFL crazy places, I am even more convinced of that.  KC is a bit more bandwaginish that I thought it was with the NFL.

[kcmetro]

Even so, the difference in the fans is still there.  I would say that most MU fans I knew or know in the MO burbs, their interest in MU was below that of the Chiefs and even the Royals.  I don't know why I said "even" the Royals.  It think the Royals are far more popular than the Chiefs, at least in all the circles I ran in.

While most KU fans, it would be KU, then "maybe" the Chiefs and Royals.  But with KU fans, it seems more likely that it would be 90% KU first.  Everything else is a distant second.

There is a very simple explanation for this difference between KU and MU fans.  KU basketball wins.  Every year.  Over the past 30 years, KU has more wins than any other college program.  This is the reason KU fans place their college above the Royals and Chiefs in this metro, especially given how sorry both the pro teams have been over the same period.

[KC0KEK]

First off, a large percent of the people in DC don't care about sports period.  Or at least a far higher percent than what you see in places like KC (or even Baltimore).  Sports (college and pro) are just pretty far down.  It's simply an entertainment option if one feels like partaking.

I don't know if College Park is more closely aligned with Baltimore than DC, but these fans sure take sports seriously: www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/a ... 02390.html. BTW, dig the "Fear the Turtle" sign in the photo. I wonder if rival fans have ever used the term's Urban Dictionary definition to poke fun at the slogan.

[NDTeve]

Not trying to flame, but if MU won a national championship, went to a Final Four, or had a big time football program on par with KSU in the 90's/2000's, etc, you'd see their passion more like that of KU/KSU.

[kcmetro]

You very rarely see people wearing any sort of sports clothing etc and when you do, it's usually on trains going to and from the stadiums for games or tourists.

I wish this is how it was here too.  I live in JOCO and you can't go anywhere without seeing KU apparel.  Not that I really mind seeing it since I'm a KU fan, but I never wear KU gear unless I'm going to a game or watching a KU game at a bar or something.  I just find it a bit juvenile and tacky to be walking around with Jayhawks all over your clothes all the time.

[GRID]

There is a very simple explanation for this difference between KU and MU fans.  KU basketball wins.  Every year.  Over the past 30 years, KU has more wins than any other college program.  This is the reason KU fans place their college above the Royals and Chiefs in this metro, especially given how sorry both the pro teams have been over the same period.

While I'm not really debating the reasons and I agree with you to some extent, I honestly don't think Missouri residents would ever be as passionate as Kansas residents when it comes to college sports regardless of performance, especially those on the east side of the state.

Kansas has the history for one and doesn't really have anything else (that is really their own) for two.

I don't know if College Park is more closely aligned with Baltimore than DC, but these fans sure take sports seriously: www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/a ... 02390.html. BTW, dig the "Fear the Turtle" sign in the photo. I wonder if rival fans have ever used the term's Urban Dictionary definition to poke fun at the slogan.

I work with a lot of people, but I don't know what college most went to.  In my immediate area of about 30 people there are four people that are into college sports.

Two are Maryland, one is Kstate and one is KU.  Freaking crazy haha.  The Maryland fans are pretty hard core.  I never said they didn't have college fans, I said, it's a far lower percent of the population.

I would say that Maryland is more tied to Baltimore than DC,  even though College Park is inside the DC beltway.  It's in the state of Maryland though and so the Balitmore area probably has more influence.