St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Want to talk about your favorite places besides Kansas City? Post any development news or questions about other cities here.
Post Reply
User avatar
FangKC
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 13912
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 10:02 pm
Location: Old Northeast -- Indian Mound

St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by FangKC » Thu Jan 31, 2019 2:23 am

City, Meet County: St. Louis Weighs Historic Merge
On Monday, the St. Louis think tank Better Together unveiled a formal proposal to combine the City of St. Louis and St. Louis County in a new type of local government for Missouri: a metropolitan city. Governed by an elected “Metro Mayor” and a 33‑member council, the new Metro City of St. Louis would have sweeping powers to enact new laws, tax residents, and oversee law enforcement, justice, planning, zoning, and economic development. This proposal, which would be decided by voters across Missouri, would essentially do away with the present government of the City of St. Louis, including the city’s 29-member Board of Aldermen and the office of Mayor Lyda Krewson.

Such a consolidation would overnight transform St. Louis into the 10th largest city in the U.S., with 1.3 million people—larger than San Jose and right behind Dallas.
...
https://www.bettertogetherstl.com/

https://www.citylab.com/equity/2019/01/ ... %3A11%3A40

User avatar
warwickland
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 4740
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 6:29 pm
Location: University City, MO

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by warwickland » Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:46 am

chesterfield is threatening to SECEDE JUST LIKE st. louis city did in 1876.

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/gov ... 0c9d0.html

hoffa270
Surface Lot
Posts: 0
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:03 am

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by hoffa270 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 11:41 am

a few chesterfield Council members are proposing this. Many chesterfield residents are against this.

flyingember
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 7534
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by flyingember » Thu Jan 31, 2019 12:07 pm

At best, changing counties has some value.

Through 2007 the last one was in 1879 but there's no reason that just like annexation a community couldn't choose to change counties. I could see allowing the tail of KC in Cass to choose to join Jackson, for example.


There's a cool map here showing county changes over time.
https://publications.newberry.org/ahcbp/map/map.html#MO

hoffa270
Surface Lot
Posts: 0
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:03 am

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by hoffa270 » Thu Jan 31, 2019 1:04 pm

Good afternoon KC. Most of you are looking at this post and thinking this has nothing to do with me. So why have a statewide vote? Because it has to be a statewide vote. A local vote is not an option.

(Michael A. Wolff is a former judge and chief justice of the Missouri Supreme Court)
"Only a statewide vote to change the Missouri Constitution would enable change of the breadth and scope needed to move the unified metro area forward. The Better Together proposal offers the chance to achieve a rational unification of our fragmented community. This requires a constitutional amendment to become a reality."

I'm posting this because this is going to be on the 2020 statewide ballot, and I don't want out state voters to oppose this plan because they think the municipal mayors opposing this plan is a reflection of the residents of St Louis city and county.
It is not. The mayors are opposing this plan simply because they don't want to lose the power they have in controlling municipalities that are 1 sq mile with a population of fewer than 200 people and there own police force that employs maybe 15 police officers, 5 officers per shift. I get it power over a small city or small town is hard to give up. For example the mayor of florissant who is one of the main mayors opposing this merger tried to force the florissant courts to erase his son's criminal record. Google It. So to the Mayors it's not about you it's about us residents. Those who oppose this will have you believe Things Like the officers will lose their jobs, they will not they will become metro city police officers. The police force will have more officers, 1,100 officers in the county who can't cross city lines would combine with the 1,300 officers in the city who can't cross county lines, give or take a few. So the police force will pretty much double and they will be able to patrol the entire Metro city if need be. That would double the number of officers to fight the crime issue. In fact, there is an article on stltoday.com, where the county police chief wants to merge city and county police departments.
I am a county resident who supports this plan 100%.
Me and many of the county residents are tired of driving down 1 street within 5 minutes you will drive through 5 municipalities, with 5 different courts, and 5 different police departments, it is absolutely ridiculous.
So Kc since there is no way to make this a local vote and it has to be a statewide vote to amend the constitution your voice will be heard. There was an article on kansascity.com with the viewpoints of the mayors opposing this merger. I'm here as a St Louis County resident letting you know from St Louis that it is not about the mayors and them trying to keep the power they have, It is about us residents and we want change. The Mayors, Separate Government, and Municipalities have had 142 years and nothing good came from doing things the way they want to keep it. Just the loss of population, The loss of businesses, Jobs and corporate headquarters leaving town and the state. Which has an economic impact on the entire state of Missouri.

User avatar
FangKC
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 13912
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 10:02 pm
Location: Old Northeast -- Indian Mound

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by FangKC » Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:41 am

This has implications for Kansas City as well. A successful merger in St. Louis might eventually lead to some future city mergers here. Probably not Jackson County as a whole with KCMO, but there may come a day when it makes sense for some municipalities like Gladstone, Birmingham, Randolph, Raytown, Claycomo, Pleasant Valley, Ferrellview, Platte Woods, Lake Waukomis, Northmoor, Weatherby Lake, and Avondale to merge with KCMO.

kcjak
Penntower
Penntower
Posts: 2096
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:02 pm

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by kcjak » Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:34 am

I can't imagine any municipalities wanting to be merged into KC - losing local control of police, increased taxes with less control over local ordinances, etc.

User avatar
normalthings
Valencia Place
Valencia Place
Posts: 1718
Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2015 9:52 pm

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by normalthings » Fri Feb 01, 2019 9:39 am

kcjak wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:34 am
I can't imagine any municipalities wanting to be merged into KC - losing local control of police, increased taxes with less control over local ordinances, etc.
Ray town is one of the few places I can see supporting a merger. However, KC needs to focus on deannexing its farmlands and life draining suburbs 1st. Any annexations should be of areas that are financially solvent in the long term (no suburbs).

User avatar
FangKC
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 13912
Joined: Sat Jul 26, 2003 10:02 pm
Location: Old Northeast -- Indian Mound

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by FangKC » Fri Feb 01, 2019 3:56 pm

Some of the smaller ones probably have difficulty financially supporting a police department, or don't have one at all. I think the counties' sheriff's office provides law enforcement in some.

Raytown has been having financial and management problems.

https://www.kansascity.com/news/politic ... 52115.html

https://www.kansascity.com/opinion/edit ... 69410.html

Clay County is also under scrutiny for financial and management problems. Gladstone, Claycomo, Randolph, Birmingham, and Pleasant Valley are all in Clay County.

https://www.kansascity.com/news/politic ... 75885.html

https://www.kshb.com/news/local-news/st ... lay-county

Randolph is a mess. It shut down its' police department and city court. It's not really a functioning town.

https://fox4kc.com/2016/11/15/problems- ... -recourse/

Northmoor basically survives off a strip mall and two used car dealerships.

If the Ford Plant ever shuts down, Claycomo is screwed because they are mostly dependent on it.

hoffa270
Surface Lot
Posts: 0
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:03 am

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by hoffa270 » Mon Feb 04, 2019 9:45 am

[quote=FangKC post_id=588400 time=1549054619 user_id=114]
Some of the smaller ones probably have difficulty financially supporting a police department, or don't have one at all. I think the counties' sheriff's office provides law enforcement in some.

Raytown has been having financial and management problems.

[url]https://www.kansascity.com/news/politic ... 52115.html[/url]

[url]https://www.kansascity.com/opinion/edit ... 69410.html[/url]

Clay County is also under scrutiny for financial and management problems. Gladstone, Claycomo, Randolph, Birmingham, and Pleasant Valley are all in Clay County.

[url]https://www.kansascity.com/news/politic ... 75885.html[/url]

[url]https://www.kshb.com/news/local-news/st ... lay-county[/url]

Randolph is a mess. It shut down its' police department and city court. It's not really a functioning town.

[url]https://fox4kc.com/2016/11/15/problems- ... -recourse/[/url]

Northmoor basically survives off a strip mall and two used car dealerships.

If the Ford Plant ever shuts down, Claycomo is screwed because they are mostly dependent on it.
[/quote]

Maybe you guys in KC should put some type of group together to do research to see if it would be a good thing for KC.
The group here in st louis has done 5 plus years of research.
The findings show we need a merger bad.
They have done a few poles and the results show massive support for the merger

The law in Missours says there has to be a statewide vote for a city and county to merge.
Help stl merge and stl will definitely help kc merge lbvs

Imagine missouri being home to the 9th and 10th largest cities in the country.

Chris Stritzel
Strip mall
Strip mall
Posts: 131
Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:27 pm
Location: St. Louis/Kansas City
Contact:

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by Chris Stritzel » Mon May 06, 2019 5:01 pm

Better Together has withdrawn the measure.

https://www.stltoday.com/news/local/gov ... e-breaking

earthling
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 4953
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:27 pm

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by earthling » Mon May 06, 2019 5:42 pm

My W County sisters and husbands are not for it. They don't understand that strengthening the city helps the county and county is essentially shrinking. Granted it's complicated but many don't even see the basic benefits as possible so will be a tough sell.

User avatar
warwickland
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 4740
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 6:29 pm
Location: University City, MO

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by warwickland » Thu May 09, 2019 12:26 pm

it was hamfisted in that way that all rex sinquefield related things are. i was initially in favor of it but former stl county exec stengers involvement, who may be headed to prison, killed any chance it had. i live in inner county and the anti-merger signs have popped up like mushrooms after a wet spring...so it's not just west county people.

Sani
Pad site
Pad site
Posts: 70
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2006 5:22 pm
Location: The Kansas side (sorry)

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by Sani » Fri May 10, 2019 6:58 am

Some sort of consolidation is definitely required, even if it's piecemeal. It's depressing when you look at Hanley Road south of Highway 40 and see a Home Depot in Brentwood, a Menards in Richmond Heights, and a Lowe's in Maplewood, all within half a mile of each other, and all built with TIF by cities competing for sales tax dollars by tearing down old (historically Black) neighborhoods. They weren't abandoned, high-crime neighborhoods. The cities used tax dollars to buy out and tear down the homes so they could give the land to developers to build strip malls. If the three cities were one city instead, they wouldn't be tripping over themselves to chase the same tax dollars.

User avatar
warwickland
Oak Tower
Oak Tower
Posts: 4740
Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2005 6:29 pm
Location: University City, MO

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by warwickland » Fri May 10, 2019 8:32 am

Sani wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 6:58 am
Some sort of consolidation is definitely required, even if it's piecemeal. It's depressing when you look at Hanley Road south of Highway 40 and see a Home Depot in Brentwood, a Menards in Richmond Heights, and a Lowe's in Maplewood, all within half a mile of each other, and all built with TIF by cities competing for sales tax dollars by tearing down old (historically Black) neighborhoods. They weren't abandoned, high-crime neighborhoods. The cities used tax dollars to buy out and tear down the homes so they could give the land to developers to build strip malls. If the three cities were one city instead, they wouldn't be tripping over themselves to chase the same tax dollars.
That area is outrageous...the county needs consolidation more than the city - city coffers excepted.

I'm thinking (re) expanding the county to cover the city once again, and steadily merging services and departments (which is already happening - metro sewer, recycling, transit - albeit way too slowly) until there is no substantial difference between the county and the city.

The better together way was a top-down st. louis ruling class edict which was NOT going to go well based upon that alone.

User avatar
TrolliKC
Strip mall
Strip mall
Posts: 145
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:27 am

Re: St Louis: City and County Consider Merger

Post by TrolliKC » Fri May 10, 2019 2:13 pm

kcjak wrote:
Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:34 am
I can't imagine any municipalities wanting to be merged into KC - losing local control of police, increased taxes with less control over local ordinances, etc.
Yes - just like no municipalities want to merge into STL

Post Reply