OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Find out what's going on in the Sunflower State's portions of the Metro here.
aknowledgeableperson
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 12247
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:31 pm

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by aknowledgeableperson » Tue Jul 16, 2013 10:48 am

No public subsidies, no Cerner.
Sounds like any large development anywhere in the KC metro area.

kboish
Penntower
Penntower
Posts: 2364
Joined: Mon Nov 26, 2007 12:25 am
Location: West Plaza

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by kboish » Tue Jul 16, 2013 12:42 pm

aknowledgeableperson wrote:
No public subsidies, no Cerner.
Sounds like any large development anywhere in the KC metro area United States.
FTFY

knucklehead
Alameda Tower
Alameda Tower
Posts: 1367
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2005 1:51 pm
Location: Martin City

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by knucklehead » Wed Jul 17, 2013 2:22 pm

The total tax subsidies in the immediate Speedway area total over $1 billion.

Of course, the KC star which obsesses over cummulative dollar figures for KCMO Tiff plans has never been able to do the math on the Speedway.

aknowledgeableperson
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 12247
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:31 pm

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by aknowledgeableperson » Wed Jul 17, 2013 9:09 pm

The problem with the Speedway incentives is the economic activity is covering the debt load. Whereas with a few of KCMO's incentives the economic activity doesn't.

aknowledgeableperson
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 12247
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:31 pm

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by aknowledgeableperson » Thu Jul 18, 2013 9:47 am

It is really more complex than that. There are two issues with the P&L. One is the necessity of it and its impact. The second is how the complex was financed. Those two issues would also apply to the whole speedway complex, of which Village West is part of.

With regards to the P&L yes the complex was a necessity and its impact has been great. But the finances of the P&L complex itself have been underperforming and therefore the general taxpayer subsidy. And that has been the lighting rod for the critical comments on the complex. TIF was the wrong way to go, or the pols could have been upfront and said there was no way for the complex to be self supporting and a large subsidy was necessary but worthwhile. The city could have gone the way of OKC and Tulsa and gone to the voters and ask for general tax increases for the whole of downtown development but I would imagine for many reasons the council decided to go the easy route and use TIF.

flyingember
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 6909
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by flyingember » Mon Jul 29, 2013 9:00 pm

aknowledgeableperson wrote:The problem with the Speedway incentives is the economic activity is covering the debt load. Whereas with a few of KCMO's incentives the economic activity doesn't.
not really. The Legends sold on the courthouse steps. Several area big box stores have already closed. They're right on the edge of over extended on the area.

longviewmo
Colonnade
Colonnade
Posts: 880
Joined: Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:58 am
Location: Manhattan, Kansas
Contact:

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by longviewmo » Mon Jul 29, 2013 11:03 pm

flyingember wrote:
aknowledgeableperson wrote:The problem with the Speedway incentives is the economic activity is covering the debt load. Whereas with a few of KCMO's incentives the economic activity doesn't.
not really. The Legends sold on the courthouse steps. Several area big box stores have already closed. They're right on the edge of over extended on the area.
Several? I can only think of Best Buy (along with 50+ others nationwide, and not located in Legends anyways) and Books A Million (which relocated and got a lot smaller, again part of a larger corporate failure)

aknowledgeableperson
City Center Square
City Center Square
Posts: 12247
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:31 pm

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by aknowledgeableperson » Tue Jul 30, 2013 12:10 am

not really. The Legends sold on the courthouse steps. Several area big box stores have already closed. They're right on the edge of over extended on the area.
That did not affect the status of public debt. No tax dollars lost. Tax revenues generated still cover debt payments for the area.

User avatar
KCMax
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 24051
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 3:31 pm
Location: The basement of a Ross Dress for Less
Contact:

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by KCMax » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:55 am


mgsports
Broadway Square
Broadway Square
Posts: 2540
Joined: Sat May 31, 2008 7:00 pm

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by mgsports » Mon Sep 09, 2013 6:25 pm


mgsports
Broadway Square
Broadway Square
Posts: 2540
Joined: Sat May 31, 2008 7:00 pm

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by mgsports » Sun Sep 15, 2013 7:56 pm

Also next to Jack in the Box Fast Food Chain and next to Sam's Club Major Anchor coming.

User avatar
KCMax
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 24051
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 3:31 pm
Location: The basement of a Ross Dress for Less
Contact:

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by KCMax » Thu Sep 26, 2013 3:34 pm


geeman68
Western Auto Lofts
Western Auto Lofts
Posts: 656
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:22 am
Location: Kansas City, MO

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by geeman68 » Fri Sep 27, 2013 8:06 am

The article says that The Legends is moving to a more ful fledge outlet presence. This would mean all those Cerner workers stranded out there have one less option to go eat at and apparently, The Legends is going to push for more restaurants to depart... at least within the "mall" itself. Gah!

brewcrew1000
Penntower
Penntower
Posts: 2259
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:10 am
Location: Broadway/Gilham according to google maps

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by brewcrew1000 » Fri Sep 27, 2013 9:17 am

Do you think in 10-15 years Legends will look like the Great Mall or the one out in Odessa or even Warrenton by STL or does this one actually have staying power with the stuff around it

User avatar
smh
Hotel President
Hotel President
Posts: 3009
Joined: Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:40 pm
Location: Central Loop

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by smh » Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:05 am

brewcrew1000 wrote:Do you think in 10-15 years Legends will look like the Great Mall or the one out in Odessa or even Warrenton by STL or does this one actually have staying power with the stuff around it
Perhaps take this with a grain of salt because I've never actually been out to the Great Mall. But I don't think the Village West/Legends area will look like Odessa because there is simply too much money invested. Even if the "Legends" shopping itself becomes a bunch of VF, Lee Jeans, and Mountain Man Nut & Fruit Co. outlets I still think the area will be busy because of the stadium/track, NFM, casino, and all the other retail developments.

I'm not saying I like this, but I do think it is how it will be.

geeman68
Western Auto Lofts
Western Auto Lofts
Posts: 656
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2008 12:22 am
Location: Kansas City, MO

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by geeman68 » Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:34 am

smh wrote:
brewcrew1000 wrote:Do you think in 10-15 years Legends will look like the Great Mall or the one out in Odessa or even Warrenton by STL or does this one actually have staying power with the stuff around it
Perhaps take this with a grain of salt because I've never actually been out to the Great Mall. But I don't think the Village West/Legends area will look like Odessa because there is simply too much money invested. Even if the "Legends" shopping itself becomes a bunch of VF, Lee Jeans, and Mountain Man Nut & Fruit Co. outlets I still think the area will be busy because of the stadium/track, NFM, casino, and all the other retail developments.

I'm not saying I like this, but I do think it is how it will be.
I agree with you to a point, however, what happends if Legends pushes out all the eating/dining options? No where to eat before or after an event or what there is out there will be too busy to try and patronize if only a handful of places are left. I don't personally want to hit Wendy's or McDs and those places are packed around event times. The casino is a different animal and people usually spend their time/money within the casino. NFM?... When IKEA opens, how will that affect NFM's volume? EVERYONE I know intends to never go back to NFM once IKEA opens. Anyways, The only time I go out that direction is for Sporting (love them, hate the location) and Schlitterbahn. In the course of 5 visits to that area since the beginnning of the year, I've actually gone to a restaurant or store once outside of the event I was attending. Bleh.

flyingember
One Park Place
One Park Place
Posts: 6909
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:54 am

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by flyingember » Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:46 am

brewcrew1000 wrote:Do you think in 10-15 years Legends will look like the Great Mall or the one out in Odessa or even Warrenton by STL or does this one actually have staying power with the stuff around it
The Legends is more like Branson or the one at Osage Beach, you go there for multiple things in the same area. it can be made part of a larger trip

Odessa built shopping that was based around cheap gas, much like Warrenton, you have to make a special effort to go there, even when passing by.

the question more becomes what type of stores lease space, that it will be there I think is a given. I don't see being a shopping district only as working, they need the whole package to work. go for lunch and hop into a shop for the convenience. pushing the food to the outskirts makes it too easy to park close to the restaurant to eat and then leave. the mixed setup is the plaza way and it will need to become the downtown way

winB
Parking Garage
Parking Garage
Posts: 26
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 12:57 pm

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by winB » Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:56 am

geeman68 wrote:
smh wrote:
brewcrew1000 wrote: NFM?... When IKEA opens, how will that affect NFM's volume? EVERYONE I know intends to never go back to NFM once IKEA opens.
Have any of those people ever been to an IKEA?? That's like saying you'll never visit Long John Silvers again once Chipotle opens. They both have food but that's where the similarities end. NFM actually came out publicly in support of IKEA because it can only help their sales.

longviewmo
Colonnade
Colonnade
Posts: 880
Joined: Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:58 am
Location: Manhattan, Kansas
Contact:

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by longviewmo » Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:10 pm

How many restaurants have already failed out there? A dozen?

User avatar
KCMax
Global Moderator
Global Moderator
Posts: 24051
Joined: Wed Aug 04, 2004 3:31 pm
Location: The basement of a Ross Dress for Less
Contact:

Re: OFFICIAL: The Legends at Village West

Post by KCMax » Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:11 pm

longviewmo wrote:How many restaurants have already failed out there? A dozen?
Considering how often restaurants fail, that's probably about average. The concern would be if there were tons of empty spaces out there, but I haven't found that to be the case.

Post Reply