OFFICIAL: Zona Rosa (tenants & phase II)

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OFFICIAL: Zona Rosa (tenants & phase II)

Postby kcmajik » Tue Jan 28, 2003 7:24 pm

I have issues with Steiner Associates building the new Zona Rosa in the Northland. I have been to Steiner's Newport on the Levee in Newport, Kentucky(across Ohio River from Cincinatti) and it's nothing to brag about. I've also been to Steiner's webpage and there's no good information about what EXACTLY will be the main attraction. I pray to God that is not a waste of prime commercial ground. The Northland cannot afford another Metro North.

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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby trailerkid » Wed Jan 29, 2003 1:43 am

It's just a shopping center. What's the main attraction of Town Center or Oak Park? Although it would've been nice if Zona Rosa would've landed Nordstrom, Galyan's, and Lord and Taylor.

As for Metro North, they just need better management and a little remodeling. There's malls in small towns that have better stores than that place. One word-- pathetic!

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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KCPowercat » Wed Jan 29, 2003 8:57 am

ZR will be a nice development....I would hope it's much better than Town Center Plaza...it will be a semi-mixed use development and not just a high class strip mall.

Hopefully they will land some cool clients and they already have landed a couple tenants that are unique to the metro...which is always a good thing.
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KC_JAYHAWK » Wed Jan 29, 2003 9:59 am

Town Center Plaza is by far not the Country Club Plaza but it is not as bad as what I always read on these postings. What do you expect for retail in the Subs. It's by far better than anything I've seen anywhere else in the metro area (the new Lee's Summitt plaza is anything but unique, and that goes for the development on 1-29/Barry Road.....very blaaahhhh). I can almost guarantee that the majority of readers on this board would be raving about Town Center Plaza if it were in the Northland or East Jackson county. Remember OP/JOCO is not the problem....people if I remember correctly, there are suburbs on the Missouri side also. :wink:
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KCPowercat » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:33 am

most people would be pleased, but most people are pleased to get a new "Gap" or whatever....we are not most people. I don't fault the stores or whatever but I do like that ZR seems be be bringing in new clients instead of the same old American Eagle (which it probably will still have)

Reason I think most people don't like it is it's nothing but a strip mall.....it's a strip of stores with parking in front. No mixed use, no density....Now something like the Lenexa project I'm very down with.

Hopefully ZR will be much more like the Lenexa project.
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KC_JAYHAWK » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:51 am

What's the Lenexa project? More retail I assume.

BTW, I have a friend that's an assistant mgr at the BR in Town Center Plaza and she said that there are rumors that Neiman Marcus is very interested in the old Jacobsons store. Of course this just could be a rumor, but it would be a good draw for the entire metro area. Any thoughts?
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Postby KCPowercat » Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:53 am

That would be a good pickup.....I also liked the idea of gettng a Crate & Barrell in there. Still don't like the setup though...

Lenexa Project:
Image

If Good2Great stops in, he will tell you all about it....I don't know much about the details except it's going to be a true mixed use development.
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KCgridlock » Wed Jan 29, 2003 12:42 pm

Town Center does pretty much suck, Galyans is cool, but the center itself is a glorified strip mall. You never hear me saying great things about the boring shopping centers out east and north either. Summit Woods and Barry Woods are just typical suburban big box centers. All I ever say is that the same stores are out east and north, JoCo just dresses them up a little better. Zona Rosa will be good, not great but better than anything in suburban KC now. I am a little disapointed in them though. They have eliminated most of the residential and the retail they are landing is not all top notch.

If Town Center builds what I have in front of me, than everything will change.
First off, I have to give JoCo credit where due. This is a very very high
density, mixed used development and as much as much as a JoCo critic
that I am, this is pretty awesome. Now, I would MUCH MUCH rather see
this built in the core or even in the MO burbs, but still, it would be a nice change
from typical KC suburban development.

A quick rough summary:

1 eight story office above 1 story retail
6 story hotel above two story retail
7 five story condo towers
3 eight story condo towers
large 2 story retail
all structured parking
other misc buildings and park space.

BTW, Metro North "could" be right there with Indep Center and Oak Park, as KC
stated, new management and a makeover is all it needs.

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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby trailerkid » Wed Jan 29, 2003 2:05 pm

tenants at Town Center....A+
design at Town Center.....D

This is off topic, but whatever. Town Center was built to be a "lifestyle center." The idea is that snobs don't like to walk around shopping centers with the masses. They can park their car (or Rover) in front of the store they're going to and leave easily. The problem with Town Center is that they mixed in other retail with the park and go lifestyle center concept. Stuff like AMC, Galyan's and Buckle are regional mall stores, not lifestyle center stores (J. Crew, Pottery Barn, Banana Repuplic). These stores can mix in a regional mall, but that's not what Town Center was originally supposed to be. Town Center is crowded with the upscale crowd, the teenager crowd, and moviegoers in a setting that wasn't designed to hold many shoppers. If you've ever been to One Pacific Place in Omaha, imagine adding an AMC, Galyan's, and department store to that property and you'd understand that it just doesn't fit...literally.

Also, I really do think that Zona Rosa is having more problems getting tenants than they thought they would. I don't think they knew that RED would be building the thing across the street with Talbot's and Borders. I have faith in Steiner, but after their dissappointing first annoucement of tenants I don't look for Zona Rosa to even rival Oak Park-- it may take years for Zona to really get off the ground and become competitive with Jo Co and Plaza retail.

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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KC_JAYHAWK » Wed Jan 29, 2003 3:49 pm

Hmmmm interesting, because I park and walk around Town Center all the time over my lunch break and I see a lot of other people walking around also, not to the extent of the Country Club Plaza, but still there are people walking....I also don't drive a Rover, but if I did, I don't think it would make me any less of a person.
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Postby KCPowercat » Wed Jan 29, 2003 5:29 pm

Even if they would have just built garages and not massive lots it would improve it greatly.
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KCgridlock » Wed Jan 29, 2003 6:08 pm

KCgridlock wrote:Town Center does pretty much suck, Galyans is cool, but the center itself is a glorified strip mall. You never hear me saying great things about the boring shopping centers out east and north either. Summit Woods and Barry Woods are just typical suburban big box centers. All I ever say is that the same stores are out east and north, JoCo just dresses them up a little better. Zona Rosa will be good, not great but better than anything in suburban KC now. I am a little disapointed in them though. They have eliminated most of the residential and the retail they are landing is not all top notch.

If Town Center builds what I have in front of me, than everything will change.
First off, I have to give JoCo credit where due. This is a very very high
density, mixed used development and as much as much as a JoCo critic
that I am, this is pretty awesome. Now, I would MUCH MUCH rather see
this built in the core or even in the MO burbs, but still, it would be a nice change
from typical KC suburban development.

A quick rough summary:

1 eight story office above 1 story retail
6 story hotel above two story retail
7 five story condo towers
3 eight story condo towers
large 2 story retail
all structured parking
other misc buildings and park space.

BTW, Metro North "could" be right there with Indep Center and Oak Park, as KC
stated, new management and a makeover is all it needs.


You guys catching on here? This is a new development that will go in north of the existing town center.

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Postby KCPowercat » Wed Jan 29, 2003 7:19 pm

Yeah I had heard of the area north getting all the crap....that would be pretty sweet.....I would applaud it. If they could just make that original TCP a little more dense that would rock even more.
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Postby trailerkid » Thu Jan 30, 2003 4:21 am

Here's what Town Center developers Poag and McEwen said about the concept they invented.
In addition to geographical convenience, the open-air orientation of Lifestyle Centers enables shoppers to locate stores they intend to visit from the safety of their cars and to park within sight of the storefronts. They can then quickly access the stores from their cars without having to fight through the crowds and trek the great distances that typify regional malls.

Basically, they encourage you to get in and get out, yet they add retail like AMC and B&N to totally contradict this idea. All I know is that Zona is going to look like an actual town center with streets, trees, pedestrians and not look like retail in the middle of a parking lot with Galyan's and AMC tacked on to one side.

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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby QueSi2Opie » Thu Jan 30, 2003 11:47 am

So Poag and McEwen promote obesity? That's the problem with this country, everyone's lazy and don't want so-called inconveinances, like walking. We can't let people promote a drive-thru/pick-up window nation!
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby Good2Great » Thu Jan 30, 2003 3:57 pm

KC wrote:That would be a good pickup.....I also liked the idea of gettng a Crate & Barrell in there. Still don't like the setup though...

Lenexa Project:
Image

If Good2Great stops in, he will tell you all about it....I don't know much about the details except it's going to be a true mixed use development.


Excellent! The Lenexa project is slated to be a TRUE NEW URBANISM project that, by definition, creates an urban feel of carefully blended office, residential and retail amenities in a blatant suburban setting. While the project has taken 3 years to plan, much of that time was spent negotiating with 5 parcels with divided ownerships.

The current plan is to construct the residential amenities as a first phase. Each building will be 5-7 stories in height with retail being pegged for the ground floors. A championship golf course is nearing construction adjacent to the 65 acre City Center (you can see some rough sketches at the back of the rendering).

Make no mistake, unless something goes terribly wrong, this will NOT be a Leawood Town Center, a strip center or anything resembling a MALL. We, err, they spent many weeks (*lagh* years studying other benchmark projects around the country to determine the vision for this project. The GOAL is to establish the residential/office and aesthetic feel of Addison Circle (addison, tx) with the retail allure of Steiner's Easton Town Center project in Easton, Ohio or Redmond Town Center in Redmond, WA.

If completed as planned, this will be a very unique project that can locally only be compared to the CC Plaza. A comparison that really isn't fair as the CC is the grandaddy of them all. Nothing will ever stack up, but for comparison sake, its the best local example we have.

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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby ShowME » Thu Jan 30, 2003 11:22 pm

Why is Lenexa building this so-called City Center project out in the fields near I-435? Why don't they build it near the railroad tracks of downtown Lenexa, KS? I guess they're using the same logic that applies in KCK. Heaven forbid you build something that actually improves your actual downtown. It just seems like they're trying to escape reality.
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby Good2Great » Fri Jan 31, 2003 9:24 am

Great question! The logic is that "old Town" is too confining relative to the land around it. These really aren't competing destinations. Currently NO ONE thinks to themself "Hmm, I wonder if I should spend my afternoon on the Plaza or at the barber shop in old town Lenexa." (Well, if they do, they have more probs than we have room to discuss)

Old Town will always be, well...Old Town. A quaint area near the tracks that's great for a quick lunch, haircut and that not so hard to find auto part at NAPA. The City has invetsed several million bucks in recent years to maintain the infrastructure and facilities in Old Town.

Geographically, I-435 and Renner is the precise CENTER of Lenexa with much western growth yet to occur, yet it's inevitable. Aside from maybe a barrage of strip centers along 87th Street, Lenexa really doesn't have a central meeting point or blatant centerpiece that defines the community. Lenexa City Center will create a PLACE that all residents can appreciate.

This project is the epicenter of the community. Not out in a field.
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby Good2Great » Fri Jan 31, 2003 10:40 am

What a great topic!

The desire to reside in "urban" areas is somewhat generational. Being from the midwest, many of our great-grandparents were agrarians or farming familes.

Our grandparents grew up and sought something completely different...urban living (city dwellars).

Our parents also grew up and wnated somehting new and exciting so they opted for cozy suburbs.

Now, many of us are also desiring to live and experience something new. The general feel of an "urban" environment with the fluffy amenities that have wussified our way of life (bed bath beyond, frozen custard, dean & deluca). Kind of like the accountants that ride Harleys -- pencil necks during the week until they metamorphosize into pseudo rough-necks on the weekend.

Basically, New Urnbanism is a means to allow suburbanites to masquerade as Urban Core residents. POSERS!

I'm still all for the project, I'm just able to call it like it is.
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Zona Rosa: Metro North all over again or Leawood Town Center

Postby KCPowercat » Fri Jan 31, 2003 10:50 am

G2G...that's also my theory as to why this city isn't more progressive in some areas (mass transit being a big one)....almost everybody's parents seem to be either from somewhere else and moved to KC (almost always smaller) and many of us (kind close to the same generation), or at least I am, the first to grow up my whole life in the city...at least in the metro area.

This is why I think KC is finally seeing a surge of urban living....that make sense?

BTW, my new place in Quality Hill ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Hopefully we will see the movement into urban areas (both "new urbanism" and the real urban areas) continue to increase.
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