Falls at Crackernack Creek update

[dangerboy]

http://economy.kansascity.com/?q=node/617 can elimate Lowe's from going to the Falls because it's going to Blue Ridge  Crossings.

Huh???  There was never going to be a Lowe's at the Falls.  There is already one Eastland Center, directly across the highway from Bass Pro.

[kcdcchef]

Huh???  There was never going to be a Lowe's at the Falls.  There is already one Eastland Center, directly across the highway from Bass Pro.

it is just the new incarnation of paintfumes, pay him no attention. you could stand in the parking lot of bass pro, throw a rock, and hit lowes, literally.

[StL_Dan]

FOLEY ALABAMA...man, it's totally set up for Missouri vacationers. EVERYONE from StL vacations in GULF SHORES. I used to listen to cardinals games down there at night when KMOX still had its stainless steel transmitting balls.

Maybe they are beginning to fall in love with their balls again.  It appears to be the case now that they are broadcasting Blues games again!  YES!

[mgsports]

This Topic is about the Falls not Sports Teams or even KMOX.
Maybe another Home Depot will follow.

[KCMax]

Work starts on Hobby Lobby, Mardel at Falls at Crackerneck

Hobby Lobby will occupy 55,000 square feet, and Mardel, a Christian bookstore, will occupy 25,000 square feet, according to a release from Kessinger/Hunter & Co. LC, the center?s leasing company. Bass Pro Shops occupies 180,000 square feet.

Construction is projected to be completed before year?s end.

[geeman68]

Work starts on Hobby Lobby, Mardel at Falls at Crackerneck

Hobby Lobby will occupy 55,000 square feet, and Mardel, a Christian bookstore, will occupy 25,000 square feet, according to a release from Kessinger/Hunter & Co. LC, the center?s leasing company. Bass Pro Shops occupies 180,000 square feet.

Construction is projected to be completed before year?s end.

I just have no comment to offer on these developments next to Bass Pro.

[bbqboy]

I just have no comment to offer on these developments next to Bass Pro.

Praise the Lord and pass the Plastic Worms!

[GRID]

I just have no comment to offer on these developments next to Bass Pro.

pretty sad isn't it?  Not only that, but it will move Hobby Lobby from KCMO (barley) out of an area that is trying to come back and into a super tif district.

Hobby Lobbys tend to go into class C vacant big boxes.  Not massive "mixed use" developments funded with 75 million in public money.  They should have said no to this.  At the very least, Hobby Lobby could have filled one of the boxes in the nearly empty Hartman Heritage Center.

[dangerboy]

Was the Bass Pro tax subsidy restructure?  My understanding of the original deal was that the tax break for Bass Pro was so massive that The Falls development needed a bunch top shelf accessory retail in order to pay off the tax break.  Since I doubt stores like Hobby Lobby generate enough revenue to subsidize a Bass Pro, was the deal revised?

[Pendergast]

Hobby Lobbys tend to go into class C vacant big boxes.  Not massive "mixed use" developments funded with 75 million in public money.  They should have said no to this.  At the very least, Hobby Lobby could have filled one of the boxes in the nearly empty Hartman Heritage Center.

This is not a good trend.  So it is actually cheaper to build under the TIF than it is to fill a vacant building?  I would say that most of the Hobby Lobby/Mardel deals were worked out prior to Hartman losing it tenants, so they may get a pass on this.  However, you could potentially see more new construction under TIF and see more vacant buildings.  Sad precedent to see the retail jump around.  Independence needs to buck this.

[aknowledgeableperson]

This is not a good trend.  So it is actually cheaper to build under the TIF than it is to fill a vacant building? 

Isn't this what happened up north with Zona Rosa and Metro North and other retail areas?

[im2kull]

Isn't this what happened up north with Zona Rosa and Metro North and other retail areas?

Well, Metro North is still a regular, enclosed mall, and has been for the last 20 years...so that's debatable.

[dangerboy]

Well, Metro North is still a regular, enclosed mall, and has been for the last 20 years...so that's debatable.

The point was that retail is moving from older non-subsidized shopping centers to newer subsidized centers.  In other words, the subsidies don't always bring in new business, they often just shift existing businesses from one location to another. This leaves behind a vacant buildings that then need their own subsidies.  This is certainly true with Metro North Mall.

[Pendergast]

The point was that retail is moving from older non-subsidized shopping centers to newer subsidized centers.  In other words, the subsidies don't always bring in new business, they often just shift existing businesses from one location to another. This leaves behind a vacant buildings that then need their own subsidies.  This is certainly true with Metro North Mall.

Right.  Whether it is from an enclosed mall or stand alone, the shift is there.  The detriment here is the TIF.  Obviously, The Falls warranted TIF because of the geology of the area.  But where discretion should have been used to see that Hobby Lobby/Mardels could have both went into nearby vacancies, it was not.

[dangerboy]

Obviously, The Falls warranted TIF because of the geology of the area. 

That statement is only true if you believe that this piece of ground had to be developed.  Perhaps if Independence was landlocked and had no other property available for development, but it isn't.  There were other potential sites for Bass Pro, including large swaths of land along Noland Road that are already cleared for development. TIF was only required at The Falls location because it was a piece of ground that shouldn't have been developed in the first place.

[Pendergast]

That statement is only true if you believe that this piece of ground had to be developed.  Perhaps if Independence was landlocked and had no other property available for development, but it isn't.  There were other potential sites for Bass Pro, including large swaths of land along Noland Road that are already cleared for development. TIF was only required at The Falls location because it was a piece of ground that shouldn't have been developed in the first place.

Strong point.  Though if Bass Pro went in on Noland and failed, we would have another issue.  There is something to be said for the location of Bass Pro or others, as we all know this is a perfect spot for it and Noland or other areas may not have been.  Independence gave the TIF to GET the Bass Pro, not so it could develop any certain area.

[trailerkid]

getting a Cheddar's Cafe here...this will be a nice draw for the demos in East Jax. the location in OP is wildly popular and actually gets pretty fair customer feedback.

[shinatoo]

getting a Cheddar's Cafe here...this will be a nice draw for the demos in East Jax. the location in OP is wildly popular and actually gets pretty fair customer feedback.

There is already a cheddar's at Little Blue across from Blue Ridge Bank. Is that what you are thinking of?

[trailerkid]

There is already a cheddar's at Little Blue across from Blue Ridge Bank. Is that what you are thinking of?

no idea what you're talking about. Cheddar's Casual Cafe is the name of the restaurant. there's one on 95th directly in front of Oak Park Mall. no other locations in metro KC except for St. Joe.

http://www.cheddars.com/Restaurants%20A ... e=Missouri

[cpt4599]

There is already a cheddar's at Little Blue across from Blue Ridge Bank. Is that what you are thinking of?

I think you are referring to the Corner Cafe.