Bannister Mall/Cerner

Jackson/Cass Suburbs, including South KC
aknowledgeableperson
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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby aknowledgeableperson » Sat Mar 04, 2017 12:06 am

Loyalty to KC? Sprint, Garmin and Cerner have no ties to KCMO. Sprint has its start on the Kansas side just west of the Plaza. Garmin has always been a southern JoCo company that I am aware of. Cerner has its roots in NKC.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby NorthOak » Sat Mar 04, 2017 10:00 am

aknowledgeableperson wrote:Loyalty to KC? Sprint, Garmin and Cerner have no ties to KCMO. Sprint has its start on the Kansas side just west of the Plaza. Garmin has always been a southern JoCo company that I am aware of. Cerner has its roots in NKC.


You are such a dope, you're the first to scream about metro unity and how the kansas side sprawl is so needful and necessary, etc and then are quick to use minute details about where a company is founded so that frees them of any loyalty or pride to the main city they grew up in. I worked for Sprint and know it's history. As Sprint grew into the multinational company it would become it deliberately moved to KC to be in a large city and take advantage of what a large city offers. Sprint calls KC home. Sprint has historically had several offices in KCMO and even downtown in several buildings. So don't play idiot and pretend that Sprint has no ties to KCMO when it's entire growth is because of KCMO. Sprint could and should have built downtown for every reason including financial. They built a huge ugly campus and when they laid off it was so ugly, remote and disparate that they had to give away free rent just to maintain it. Had they built downtown, after the lay-offs their half empty building would have had a better opportunity to snag up the federal employees that were consolidating while being attractive and centrally located enough to attract other companies downtown. The Sprint campus is a complete failure.

Cerner was built just across the river from downtown. As with most companies when they experience fast growth they build. Cerner decided to whore itself out to Village West and now with their turd campus in southeast KC - all for the free govt $$. Cerner calls KC home and claims (like Sprint) to have "pride in their hometown." Cerner should build downtown and have a presence in the main city with a signature tower. It's smart and good for business but the corporate fools that make these decisions want the instant corp govt welfare instead of what's best for the community and workers.

Garmin in Olathe....who cares. In the 1 in a million chance they ever built something downtown it would look like it was just shat out of a bovine backside.

Another example would be Fishnet Security (now Optiv). They grew fast and were in several buildings downtown. They rehabbed a few buildings and had plans for more growth. They could have built a significant structure in the Crossroads that would have set themselves apart and made a real statement. But they eventually whored themselves out for Sprint's free rent and govt welfare from kansas. There's simply no culture of pride or hometown loyalty in this city. It's the worst I've ever seen in the entire country and much of it is because of the state line with kansas.
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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby aknowledgeableperson » Sat Mar 04, 2017 12:06 pm

The headquarters of the company that eventually became Sprint was never located in KCMO. Yes, the company moved to "Kansas City" but not to Kansas City, Missouri. As the company grew offices may have been here and there throughout the metro area but it's main presence was never in KCMO. And Sprint's growth is not due to KCMO.
Never had said "the kansas side sprawl is so needful and necessary." But sprawl has been around, is currently around, and will be around in the future. That's just the way it is and the forces present will always keep it that way no matter how much some people may fight it.
And KC is more than KCMO. We are part of what is called "Kansas City".

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby NorthOak » Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:53 am

aknowledgeableperson wrote:The headquarters of the company that eventually became Sprint was never located in KCMO. Yes, the company moved to "Kansas City" but not to Kansas City, Missouri. As the company grew offices may have been here and there throughout the metro area but it's main presence was never in KCMO. And Sprint's growth is not due to KCMO.


The company know today as Sprint was podunk when it moved to KC. Sprint deliberately moved to KC to be in a large city and take advantage of our workforce and other amenities that a large city offers. Sprint calls KC home. Sprint has historically had several offices in KCMO and even downtown in several buildings. So don't play idiot and pretend that Sprint has no ties to KCMO when it's entire growth is because of KCMO.
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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby aknowledgeableperson » Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:01 am

I never said Sprint had no ties to KCMO. But it has not been a KCMO company. It moved to a large metro area and employed quite a few in that metro area. It's growth is due to the KC Metro area, not just KCMO alone.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby atticus23 » Thu Jun 15, 2017 10:17 pm

Just drove by this turdhole today; when will any more new buildings go up? Also, what are the chances Cerner would ever build DT KCMo?

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby mister816 » Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:56 am

it seems like they gave up. I'm sure that the project will be completed at some point (unfortunately) but what's the hold up?

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby earthling » Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:00 am

We did a Sunday afternoon drive yesterday and somehow ended up out there. It's atrocious. I was somewhat willing to understand their position at first but sigh, after seeing it, don't know what Cerner is thinking. They could have built two or three 50 story buildings downtown and more easily attract millennials who want to live/work in walkable areas. It's not just the outdated 'so last century' office park concept, it's the poor office park design and the desolate surrounding area. It's a mess, not even lipstick on pig.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby flyingember » Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:23 am

earthling wrote:We did a Sunday afternoon drive yesterday and somehow ended up out there. It's atrocious. I was somewhat willing to understand their position at first but sigh, after seeing it, don't know what Cerner is thinking. They could have built two or three 50 story buildings downtown and more easily attract millennials who want to live/work in walkable areas.


We need more comprehensive transit before that size of campus can come downtown. For each 50 story tower you need parking today for 50 stories of people. One KC Place has 1250 spots

We need to start building cross-town contiguous transit. Some lines can be in street rail, some commuter rail, some commuter bus.
Look at the bus system today. Not a single bus crosses the whole city today.
The bus to Liberty was long at threat of cancelation but it doesn't go to The Plaza with it's jobs. There's no bus on 435 connecting suburbs to Front St, Bannister or such. Our transit system as designed can't draw users because nearly everything terminates downtown only.

There's never been an East Side to Tiffany Springs bus, and there's tons of jobs near the airport. They canceled the local bus line due to lack of use and it's no wonder, it could take 3 transfers depending on where one lived (63 to Troost MAX to 129 to the canceled line) Buying a car and driving looks like a better choice

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby earthling » Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:32 am

I was making similar arguments trying to justify what Cerner was doing. OTOH, downtown used to have over 15K more workforce than it has now if I recall. If true, it can accommodate Cerner. There would be challenges given we don't have good suburban commuter transit but with $4B, Cerner could have built deep underground garages. They could also do what Bay Area companies do and provide their own private bus service with WiFi from key hotspots around metro.

In Cerner's case they are going after college grads who would more likely want to live downtown anyway. And downtown is getting schools and developing towards family living anyway, so many may not 'grow out of city living', as it this the case with professional leaning families in much larger cities.
Last edited by earthling on Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby aknowledgeableperson » Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:37 am

Yeah, downtown may have had more workers way back when but public transit was a whole lot better. And more people lived closer to downtown.
Same place but a hell of a different time. Will take a lot of time and money to get back to anything similar with regards to public transit.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby earthling » Mon Jun 19, 2017 11:40 am

I edited post pointing out that more professional leaning families are making a return to city living. Millennials may end up staying in the city even with families, not 'grow out of city living' as many GenXrs did as they had kids. Downtown KC is getting good schools and heading that direction too. So the dynamics is changing to offset other challenges like suburban transit. Cerner in particular is going after college grads from outside markets who tend to prefer walkable urban worklife. Cerner will need an effective ''work from home' program if they are going to attract thousands of college grads. That campus will turn off many.

On a related tangent... A friend was interviewing with Cerner for a job located at The Legends campus at raceway. The internal recruiter asked her (paraphrasing) 'if she'd actually be willing to work there' as if acknowledging no one at Cerner wants to. The new campus location is probably even less desirable and will need a sales pitch.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby NorthOak » Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:05 pm

My hope is that Cerner comes to their senses and halts further construction here for awhile.
Then comes up with a better plan and build a substantial tower downtown.
In the small chance they build downtown they're not going to build three 50 story towers at the same time so the transit argument is pointless. They would start with one substantial tower. If they moved forward with a 2nd building, the Plaza streetcar and Riverfront line would hopefully be in place by then. Yes, more transit would be required eventually, but it there's enough open land still available in the RCP for residential development that could house any amount of workforce Cerner would want downtown.
The north loop & highway demolition alone has 45 acres of vacant land available for residential construction.
We have the companies, resources and appeal - with the right choices, KC could get back all it lost in the 60's - 90's and more.
But everything would have to fall into place, it's one in a million, if only business and govt leadership would make the right choices.
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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby flyingember » Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:24 pm

KC won't get what it lost and we wouldn't want to. KC was a manufacturing center. Remember that the crossroads was mostly industrial.

In 1960 the city was a fraction the size. We can't build for the farthest people working downtown being at 95th and Metcalf, imagine Barry Road will be lined with farms or such. We have to build for the next 30 years at the same time we build for the next 100.

The 30 year timeframe has sprawl to 435 up north and a need for regional transit.

We have to think regional transit to be able to close the north loop. If we can't turn more suburban commuters into transit commuters to more parts of the city the future is an I-35 widening and a long-term need for the north loop.

Cerner didn't help this but you can't imagine we'd solve all problems if they were downtown. They helped reduce the need for modot to widen downtown freeways while we try to get our act together on transit.
Last edited by flyingember on Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby earthling » Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:25 pm

The Cerner CEO seems completely oblivious to benefits of being in the city and may just see a parking problem as many suburban car dependent minded do. Would love to see him backtrack as well but city leaders also want something to happen for SKC and they view this project as the ticket.

Only chance might be if Cerner struggles to get talent or people specifically quit because of the location and poorly executed environment.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby ULCajun » Mon Jun 19, 2017 3:33 pm

earthling wrote:The Cerner CEO seems completely oblivious to benefits of being in the city and may just see a parking problem as many suburban car dependent minded do. Would love to see him backtrack as well but city leaders also want something to happen for SKC and they view this project as the ticket.

Only chance might be if Cerner struggles to get talent or people specifically quit because of the location and poorly executed environment.


This is the reason i put in for quitting 2 years ago after they announced bannister. Doesn't seem to be getting through.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby Highlander » Mon Jun 19, 2017 10:14 pm

flyingember wrote:KC won't get what it lost and we wouldn't want to. KC was a manufacturing center. Remember that the crossroads was mostly industrial.



KC's still a pretty big manufacturing center. 2 auto plants, 1 motorcycle, atomic bomb shells, a US military arsenal, lots of avionics, the BEST beer in the world, and Garmin (and many more smaller manufacturing companies). Albeit, these are generally more suburban now than back in the day when manufacturing was centered along Winner Road (and Blue River) and Fairfax. The Crossroads was more of a warehouse area than manufacturing/industrial. My father worked down there in the 1960's, he was a travelling salesman for one of the many warehousing companies in the area.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby SWFan » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:27 am

flyingember wrote:
earthling wrote:We did a Sunday afternoon drive yesterday and somehow ended up out there. It's atrocious. I was somewhat willing to understand their position at first but sigh, after seeing it, don't know what Cerner is thinking. They could have built two or three 50 story buildings downtown and more easily attract millennials who want to live/work in walkable areas.


We need more comprehensive transit before that size of campus can come downtown. For each 50 story tower you need parking today for 50 stories of people. One KC Place has 1250 spots

We need to start building cross-town contiguous transit. Some lines can be in street rail, some commuter rail, some commuter bus.
Look at the bus system today. Not a single bus crosses the whole city today.
The bus to Liberty was long at threat of cancelation but it doesn't go to The Plaza with it's jobs. There's no bus on 435 connecting suburbs to Front St, Bannister or such. Our transit system as designed can't draw users because nearly everything terminates downtown only.

There's never been an East Side to Tiffany Springs bus, and there's tons of jobs near the airport. They canceled the local bus line due to lack of use and it's no wonder, it could take 3 transfers depending on where one lived (63 to Troost MAX to 129 to the canceled line) Buying a car and driving looks like a better choice


I changed jobs last year from working in the Northland to a job in Corporate Woods in JoCo. I live in KCMO near Liberty. Unless it is a case of me not knowing how to use the KCATA bus route page, I can't easily get from Liberty to Corporate Woods. There is a roughly quick bus from Liberty to downtown. But there doesn't appear to be anything convenient from downtown out to JoCo. Basically every time I've searched for a bus route it shows it will take close to 2 hours to get to work. Versus me driving 30 minutes.

I'm all for taking the bus and having it take longer than a direct drive, but I honestly wasn't expecting it to be 4 times the length. And I can't do it anyway because the times it would get me to work or when I'd have to leave work are not within the times I need to be here (roughly 7am to 6pm M-F).

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby SWFan » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:30 am

earthling wrote:In Cerner's case they are going after college grads who would more likely want to live downtown anyway. And downtown is getting schools and developing towards family living anyway, so many may not 'grow out of city living', as it this the case with professional leaning families in much larger cities.


I see people stating this, but our company's experience has been different. Most of the college grads we are picking up seem to like the JoCo suburbs. I will say, most of our grads are coming from midwestern colleges and Cerner might be picking up east/west coaster who are used to more urban-centric cities which might make an impact on the preference for suburb vs downtown living.

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Re: Bannister Mall/Cerner

Postby flyingember » Tue Jun 20, 2017 9:14 am

Here's a piece from a couple years ago. Near neighborhoods and near suburbs seem to be the big winner at 3x downtown nationwide.
So there appears to be a trend against the far suburbs so Prairie Village over Olathe is the most logical.

https://gizmodo.com/millennials-will-li ... 74100?null

We fit this mold. I'm right on the oldest edge of the millennial and fit it culturally more than the generation before. We live in Briarcliff 5 miles from downtown. We like the neighborhood, schools, having the green space and shopping options but still have easy access to urban amenities. (It's effectively as close to downtown as UMKC is)


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