18th and Vine

Discuss items in the urban core outside of Downtown as described above. Everything in the core including the east side (18th & Vine area), Plaza, Westport, Brookside, Valentine, Waldo, 39th street, & the entire midtown area.
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DaveKCMO
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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby DaveKCMO » Wed Jul 08, 2015 8:00 am

town cow wrote:He wants to build a suburban-style gated development on Vine St. south of 19th St.


i heard the demolition was complete. another piece of raytown plopped into the urban core. thanks, gates!

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby Eon Blue » Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:54 am

Yep, the half block southeast of 19th & Vine is completely cleared. It looks like there were some low-rise industrial buildings and a single legacy building. Nothing fronted 19th Street.

Does anyone know if Gates developed the mini-Raytown along "Highland" and Woodland south of 19th? Or if this new development is an extension of that?

It's a shame that this capital can't be invested in restoring the un-rehabbed buildings in the area.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby shinatoo » Wed Jul 08, 2015 10:04 am

Seams like the best thing for this area would be to extend the light rail the one.one mile down 18th street.
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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby chingon » Wed Jul 08, 2015 1:11 pm

shinatoo wrote:Seams like the best thing for this area would be to extend the light rail the one.one mile down 18th street.


Best thing for this area would be to build our baseball stadium between it and 71 HWY.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby shinatoo » Wed Jul 08, 2015 2:55 pm

chingon wrote:
shinatoo wrote:Seams like the best thing for this area would be to extend the light rail the one.one mile down 18th street.


Best thing for this area would be to build our baseball stadium between it and 71 HWY.


Very practical solution considering we are still paying of the remodel, the team owner has no desire to move and we would still want to build the rail along that route. But keep those good ideas coming.
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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby chingon » Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:22 pm

shinatoo wrote:
chingon wrote:
shinatoo wrote:Seams like the best thing for this area would be to extend the light rail the one.one mile down 18th street.


Best thing for this area would be to build our baseball stadium between it and 71 HWY.


Very practical solution considering we are still paying of the remodel, the team owner has no desire to move and we would still want to build the rail along that route. But keep those good ideas coming.


Not sure "practical" and "18th and Vine" exist in the same world of make-believe, but I have to think the expense of a streetcar extension through a light industrial wasteland where virtually no one lives within a half mile plus on either side of the route and the very, very few people who do just resoundingly voted against the only conceivable funding mechanism for extending said line, all to connect to a moribund entertainment district whose original existence was necessitated almost exclusively by institutional segregation, and whose history is not valued and future is irrelevant might also be creeping up on "practical only in the drippingly sarcastic sense" as well....

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby shinatoo » Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:46 pm

chingon wrote:
shinatoo wrote:
chingon wrote:
Best thing for this area would be to build our baseball stadium between it and 71 HWY.


Very practical solution considering we are still paying of the remodel, the team owner has no desire to move and we would still want to build the rail along that route. But keep those good ideas coming.


Not sure "practical" and "18th and Vine" exist in the same world of make-believe, but I have to think the expense of a streetcar extension through a light industrial wasteland where virtually no one lives within a half mile plus on either side of the route and the very, very few people who do just resoundingly voted against the only conceivable funding mechanism for extending said line, all to connect to a moribund entertainment district whose original existence was necessitated almost exclusively by institutional segregation, and whose history is not valued and future is irrelevant might also be creeping up on "practical only in the drippingly sarcastic sense" as well....


The discussion is about how to spur development in the area and connect 18th and Vine to the Crossroads. Nobody said it was a good idea. All they asked is how do we do it. Streetcar is the best way to spur development, and by definition it would connect the Vine district and Crossroads. Line is going to run that way eventually to connect to the rock island line for commuter rail.
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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby chingon » Thu Jul 09, 2015 9:48 am

shinatoo wrote:The discussion is about how to spur development in the area and connect 18th and Vine to the Crossroads.


Right, and I proffered what I thought, and still think, is the "best" way to do that, in a purely hypothetical sense, just like a streetcar extension to 18th and Vine is purely hypothetical.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby JBmidtown » Thu Jul 09, 2015 10:56 am

you two are cute

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby shinatoo » Thu Jul 09, 2015 11:15 am

We fight because we love.
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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby chingon » Thu Jul 09, 2015 1:01 pm

shinatoo wrote:We fight because we love.


I demand satisfaction.

Image

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby FangKC » Thu Jul 09, 2015 6:24 pm

The only way to connect the Jazz District to the Crossroads is to rezone the blocks adjacent to 18th Street from industrial to residential, and slowly rebuild the population density along that street, and around the district itself. That includes denser mixed-income multi-family housing along Vine and Woodland to the south. The Jazz District is never going to viable until the population density around it is increased dramatically.

There is no potential for a streetcar extension to the Jazz District until this is partially-accomplished, and there is a bigger tax base to support it. As it stands now, there are hardly any for-profit businesses along E. 18th Street from Cherry east that could even support dedicated transportation district.

I don't see any full-scale redevelopment of the area for decades though, because developers see it as a riskier area, and there are much less risky areas to develop in Greater Downtown.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby flyingember » Fri Jul 10, 2015 10:40 am

The Jazz District's problem isn't that there hasn't been an effort at it, but that any way to get there makes the area look scary. The industrial/abandoned look counters all the good work done.

I would argue that the district will become a viable tourism spot the day a chain sandwich shop opens up. That's a good benchmark for there being enough residents to support an area as an independent business district.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby FangKC » Fri Jul 10, 2015 9:56 pm

I think that the retail node of the neighborhood needs to first serve the neighborhood, including people who already live nearby. That would include simple businesses like barber/beauty salons, dry cleaners, convenience store, bank branch, and perhaps some smaller offices for an insurance or real estate agent, or perhaps a medical clinic and dentist's office. Maybe a couple of small restaurants and take-out places. One of the problems with attracting businesses that serve the neighborhood residents has been that the rents are too high in the newer-construction buildings for most small businesses to open there. Many of the older buildings that could provide cheaper rent were demolished, or are uninhabitable without extensive renovation.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby FangKC » Wed Sep 09, 2015 10:42 pm

For once, things are looking up for the beleaguered 18th & Vine District

City, state and federal officials are working with Major League Baseball to develop a portion of Parade Park, immediately north of the 18th & Vine District, into a baseball-centric theme park of sorts. Kansas City leaders are trying to tie up loose financing ends to build what MLB calls an Urban Youth Academy in the park.

MLB's Urban Youth Academy hosts free baseball and softball training year-round. Kansas City's academy, if plans come to fruition, would be the sixth such facility in the United States.

The first was built in Compton, California. Since then, others have opened in Houston, New Orleans, Philadelphia and, most recently, Cincinnati.

The academy would be part of a larger project adjacent to 18th & Vine that would include four baseball diamonds designed for Little League Baseball play, as well as tennis courts in Parade Park.

Planned announcements have been in the works at various points this summer, though each has been postponed because financials haven't added up to the $13.7 million that the project is expected to cost.


http://www.pitch.com/kansascity/for-once-things-are-looking-up-for-the-beleaguered-18th-and-vine-district/Content?oid=5943270

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby DaveKCMO » Fri Sep 11, 2015 8:04 am

panel discussion this saturday on 18th street corridor: http://kccrossroads.org/crossroads-even ... community/

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby longviewmo » Fri Sep 11, 2015 10:52 pm

I'm pretty sure that the MLB funding is "private $$", but that'd go against your anti-gubment tirade.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby FangKC » Sat Sep 12, 2015 12:20 am

Ollie Gates has also invested his own money to begin renovation of the former YMCA building, and I believe he is also planning to build new apartments on the SE corner of 19th and Paseo.

There have also been four other mixed income apartment and townhouse projects built in the 18th and Vine neighborhood since 2002, after the initial investment in rebuilding the district, and all four of those were built using private financing and investment.

Apartments at Highland Place, Dromara Development LLC; broker, McCormack Baron Ragan Management Services Inc. Located on Highland Avenue between 18th and 19th streets. 2013.

Jazz District Apartments, Jazz District Phase 2 Associates LLC, which includes an affiliate of McCormack Baron Salazar as general partner and AIG SunAmerica Inc. of Los Angeles as equity partner. Located on the NE corner of 19th and Paseo, and on E. 19th Street. 2007.

Vine Street Lofts, 22nd and Vine, developed by the Black Economic Union and financed by Bank of America. 2003.

Beacon Park Townhomes, 26th and Vine, Developed by Omni Development Group LLC and Paseo Baptist Church.

In addition, Vine Street Manor, 24th and Vine. Developed by the Black Economic Union, the local advocacy group Move Up, and the Bethel African-Methodist-Episcopal congregation, and financed by Bank of America. HUD provided a cash grant since it provides low income senior housing, but no financing. It is not owned or operated by the Housing Authority of Kansas City. 2004.

Monarch Manor has built, and is in the process, of building new private homes on the former Municipal Stadium site at 20th and Brooklyn. Began in 2006. Built by Don Kelly Homes. Began around 2006. Ongoing.

So there has been additional investment in the district that came from non-government sources.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby chingon » Sat Sep 12, 2015 12:04 pm

harbinger911 wrote:Is there a single private black (or white) business in the entire district?
No.


Actually, yes. There are mulitple private businesses in the district.

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Re: 18th and Vine

Postby macnw » Sat Sep 12, 2015 12:18 pm

If we were all on the same playing field, that's one thing, but brother we ain't. Try to wrap your head around that.


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