KCRag Forum

https://cityscenekc.com/ultra-luxury-63 ... an-center/

145 rooms
13 floors
Mostly facing PAC
billed as most luxurious in the region
Zero dedicated parking
A guest lounge on every floor for breakfast and an evening buffet
high end restaurant + bar on the top level
Aim for groundbreaking in summer, completion Oct 2020

Collison has the scoop

https://cityscenekc.com/ultra-luxury-63 ... an-center/

13 stories. 145 rooms. No new parking constructed. "Highest-end" hotel rooms in the metro.

*jinx

The room itself doesn't scream luxury, looks typical modern minimalist. A modern luxury room would have something like wide patios with wide vista view from a living room. Boutique old hotels might not have this but the luxury must be in services rather than room design. The lounge on each floor is also apparently the compromise to luxury rooms.

Nice to have another hotel project with no parking. This is a milestone turning point for downtown.

I really hate the traditional hotel room... two beds all in one room, bathroom, closet. I really think people want more than that now, especially families. They want living space. Places like Hyatt House with living rooms, kitchens and separate bedroom for parents/children should/will be the new norm. This doesn’t look like ‘luxury’ to me.

Can we get the freaking Embassy Suites (Old FED) conversion started first? Ugh.

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:16 am I really hate the traditional hotel room... two beds all in one room, bathroom, closet. I really think people want more than that now, especially families. They want living space. Places like Hyatt House with living rooms, kitchens and separate bedroom for parents/children should/will be the new norm. This doesn’t look like ‘luxury’ to me.

This isn't going to be for families based on how it's designed. This will be for a business traveler who comes to KC and is in meetings from 8-6. They want services to bring them things they need, to have the option to go out to eat or not, to be a place they could take a prospective customer to for dinner and put it on their room bill. The PAC will likely put up it's high end performers in it and this kind of hotel space will serve them well to bring in higher end performances.

If the convention hotel next door has 1000 attendees of a convention or show, they're positioning themselves to be where the guests of honor can stay.

You literally would see families going to a Hyatt House as you describe. Would be a good fit for downtown. They don't need a separate living room space for everyone to be high quality materials with high end services

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:16 am I really hate the traditional hotel room... two beds all in one room, bathroom, closet. I really think people want more than that now, especially families. They want living space. Places like Hyatt House with living rooms, kitchens and separate bedroom for parents/children should/will be the new norm. This doesn’t look like ‘luxury’ to me.

This hotel is not marketed for families and I don't think places like Hyatt House and Embassy Suites are the new norm for city center type hotels. I've stayed at a Staybridge suites in NYC, it was pretty basic for being a suite with a tiny sofa for its living area while the Staybridge Suites in Omaha on Dodge was a completely different story, huge living room, it had seperate bedrooms, full kitchen, washer/dryer, it looked like an apartment.

I think hotels in City Centers should be more like Traditional Hotel Rooms because it encourages people to get out and explore a city, get out and eat someplace new and maybe meet new people whether in the hotel bar or nearby bar. The Suburban Embassy Suites encourages you to veg out, watch tv and eat in the hotel room.

I would like to see a rendering of the Bathroom, the luxury places I stayed at really seemed to focus on amazing bathrooms with raindrop showerheads, seperate tubs.

flyingember wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:57 am If the convention hotel next door has 1000 attendees of a convention or show, they're positioning themselves to be where the guests of honor can stay.

Seems like such a narrow market and we already have so many hotels for high end business travelers (Loews, 21C, Crossroads, President, Ambassador, Indigo, etc.) I just think the room model will change a lot in the coming years. People want more than a bed, bath and restaurant.

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:07 am

flyingember wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:57 am If the convention hotel next door has 1000 attendees of a convention or show, they're positioning themselves to be where the guests of honor can stay.

Seems like such a narrow market and we already have so many hotels for high end business travelers (Loews, 21C, Crossroads, President, Ambassador, Indigo, etc.) I just think the room model will change a lot in the coming years. People want more than a bed, bath and restaurant.

If you're a frequent business traveler, those needs wouldn't change over time. You want a bed, bath, restaurant, and perks and you want them to be the most luxurious you can handle. For many people, hotels are necessity, not a vacation.

snigglefritz wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:19 am

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:07 am

flyingember wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 9:57 am If the convention hotel next door has 1000 attendees of a convention or show, they're positioning themselves to be where the guests of honor can stay.

Seems like such a narrow market and we already have so many hotels for high end business travelers (Loews, 21C, Crossroads, President, Ambassador, Indigo, etc.) I just think the room model will change a lot in the coming years. People want more than a bed, bath and restaurant.

If you're a frequent business traveler, those needs wouldn't change over time. You want a bed, bath, restaurant, and perks and you want them to be the most luxurious you can handle. For many people, hotels are necessity, not a vacation.

I picture the people in a show like Shen Yun being put up here with a dedicated floor for the performers and staff. A custom breakfast buffet for only their floor will go over very well. The PAC can include the rooms free or at a discount as part of selling shows to come to KC. When you don't get back to the room until 10pm or later that hotel proximity is what they need.

You can see the coordination in the garages they're using.

snigglefritz wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 10:19 am If you're a frequent business traveler, those needs wouldn't change over time. You want a bed, bath, restaurant, and perks and you want them to be the most luxurious you can handle. For many people, hotels are necessity, not a vacation.

Do we know the percentages of business hotel days vs. vacation days in KC?

Other than factoring in to the decision by CrossFirst to lend money to the developer, that metric doesn't really mean anything (if it is even available). Regardless, that still doesn't change the fact there is zero market push away from what business travelers and more high-end travelers have wanted/needed/utilized for literal decades. As others have said, vacation travelers and family travelers have accommodations either readily-available or in the pipeline. If people want to stay in sprawling acreages of a hotel room, they can stay elsewhere.

^ I hope you’re not in the industry, because changing demand for accommodations is definitely a factor that should be looked at more than just loan justification. Business has made a marked change over the last decade+ to have national business structures vs. regional. Businesspeople are traveling further and longer and want accommodations that feel like home instead of fluff luxuries. We are already seeing in the industry a move to more ‘home’ accommodations. Kansas City just isn’t meeting that demand yet. Hence, the question.

Regardless of whether the room model *may* change in the coming years, there will likely always be a demand for luxury or otherwise high-end accommodations. If the City is trying to court larger and larger conventions, concerts, artists, corporate headquarters, etc., my hunch is that those high-end visitors wont care whether a hotel room feels like home.

We stayed in the new Hotel X in Toronto last weekend. https://hotelxtoronto.com/en/

It's a very modern luxury hotel. The rooms were average, to maybe even a bit smaller than your average room. But the beds, sheets, pillows, lighting, finishes etc were all way above normal hotel rooms. Remote controls for the blinds, dimmer switches, a very large tv etc. But what really made the hotel luxurious was the amenities. You literally have a staff that is at your beck and call and while we don't typically take advantage of that sort of thing even the things we did need the staff for was quite impressive. You have several roof top decks and bars, happy hour events. We were there on a weekend and pretty much everybody was tourists, but very few families with kids. It's was just an upscale hotel and while expensive, it was a fantastic experience to spend a couple of days there. My point is they don't just cater to business travelers.

This looks like a smaller version of that.

Although I'm not sure how big the affluent/sophisticated "urban tourists" market is in KC yet, it seems to be a big market in places like Nashville and Charlotte, so I don't see why not in KC.

You forgot the exclamation point.

beautyfromashes wrote: ↑Wed Sep 12, 2018 12:06 pm ^ I hope you’re not in the industry, because changing demand for accommodations is definitely a factor that should be looked at more than just loan justification. Business has made a marked change over the last decade+ to have national business structures vs. regional. Businesspeople are traveling further and longer and want accommodations that feel like home instead of fluff luxuries. We are already seeing in the industry a move to more ‘home’ accommodations. Kansas City just isn’t meeting that demand yet. Hence, the question.

But where are they building these kind of hotels in City Center/Downtown Locations? I stay in a lot of hotels and can't think of a single place in downtown locations that have separate bedrooms with kitchens and living rooms unless you get upgraded. Some places have nothing but suites but the living room is still apart of that same room, its not walled off or anything like that. For standard room bookings I can't think of anyplace that does this in city center/downtown locations.

More renderings from here https://www.cannondesign.com/our-work/work/hotel-bravo/

Creating that stair at the end of 17th Street, connecting Baltimore to the PAC is something I have envisioned for years! I'm glad it is part of this design.

The building has enough setbacks to make it interesting. Hope to see more developed, color renderings sometime soon. I would love to see those facade materials be terracotta.