Make Grand Grand

Issues concerning Downtown as described by the Downtown Council. River to 31st Street, I-35 to Bruce R. Watkins.
KC-wildcat
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KC-wildcat »

chrizow wrote: is five blocks really too far for people to walk?  the hotels are mostly between grand and the convention center anyway. 
I don't know.  It's not too far for me, but I live DT and am accustomed to walking over driving.  I'm not a conventioner and don't know what they expect/demand when it comes to convenience.  I would hope that the 14th St. corridor through the heart of P&L would be enough to guide visitors comfortably from their convention hub to the transit line on Grand.  

I know Cordish will hate losing the event plaza on Grand, but I'm liking the idea of the Grand corridor more and more.  It's big.  It's central.  It drops people off at the front door of the SC and P&L and it has the potential to deliver one of the primary bi-products (or goals, IMO) of rail transit - development of vacant parcels.  Grand, unfortunately, has a plethora.  

I also think Grand is best suited for a dedicated ROW or limited trolley-only lane during peak hours.  
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chrizow
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by chrizow »

KC-wildcat wrote: .
I know Cordish will hate losing the event plaza on Grand, but I'm liking the idea of the Grand corridor more and more.  It's big.  It's central.  It drops people off at the front door of the SC and P&L and it has the potential to deliver one of the primary bi-products (or goals, IMO) of rail transit - development of vacant parcels.  Grand, unfortunately, has a plethora.  
grand is by far the best choice imo.  why would cordish care about losing the "event plaza" - uh, grand is a street, not an event plaza.  you know what is an event plaza?  the giant courtyard inside the P+L.  maybe they can create an "event plaza" in the P+L surface parking along 670 or one of the half-dozen surface lots near the sprint center instead of taking up downtown's most obvious transit corridor for the Big 12 for a week each year.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by DaveKCMO »

downtown council doesn't want a road diet :(
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smh
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by smh »

DaveKCMO wrote: downtown council doesn't want a road diet :(
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by kboish »

Did they say what they do want?  or why they don't want road diet?
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by DaveKCMO »

kboish wrote: Did they say what they do want?  or why they don't want road diet?
i'm sure something will change with that, based on support for previous traffic calming efforts. crossroads supports a road diet, and it's clear that parks thinks it's necessary too. unfortunately, grand is on the "major street plan" and that "requires" four lanes.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by kboish »

Seems odd that they would oppose considering a UMB exec sits on their board and UMB is pushing the plan.  Who told you they oppose it...staff? (actually just interested not trying to sound pushy)?  I also am not really sure what the downtown council does and what impact they have.  Aren't they supposed to be supporting positive development downtown?  why would they care about the "major street plan"? 
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by FangKC »

Nashville revamps a downtown boulevard.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20100 ... -city-core

Image
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by shinatoo »

+1
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Highlander
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by Highlander »

FangKC wrote:Nashville revamps a downtown boulevard.

http://www.tennessean.com/article/20100 ... -city-core

Image

Ouch. That's ugly. It needs storefronts and signage. Just looks dead and uninviting. Hoping KC can do better.
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FangKC
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by FangKC »

I posted it not so much for the buildings, but the way they dressed up the street with wide patterned sidewalks, a planted median, street trees, and lighting.

Unfortunately, it's hard to change the types of buildings already existing along a boulevard--especially ones that were designed hostile to the street.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by pash »

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Last edited by pash on Thu Feb 02, 2017 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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FangKC
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by FangKC »

IMO, the best boulevard we have in the tradition of the City Beautiful movement is The Paseo from around 9th Street to 14th Street. There is little street life there now, but it's because they tore everything down that used to be there.

However, it is still good infastructure, and could be a great stretch of boulevard again in the future if the City can ever reclaim that area of the city with new development.

Other than that, the best stretch of street we have in Kansas City is W. 47th from Main to Madison.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by shinatoo »

That Nashville pic is a Billion times better than what we have on Grand now.

"A good plan today is always better than a perfect plan tomorrow." Gen. George Patton
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by aknowledgeableperson »

pash wrote:The only reason that even somewhat works, in my view, is due to the sight-line leading to whatever that neoclassical facade is at the road's end.
One other reason it might work is that the street is only 3 blocks long. On both ends are 'T' intersections with government buildings on both ends.

Plenty of cars but maybe a handfull of people walking.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by KCJhawker »

For a good example of what Grand could potentially be, look to Nicollet Mall in Minneapolis. In the 60s, this 11 block long main downtown street was totally redone into a pedestrain mall. Traffic only has one lane each direction. The extended sidewalk make for easy strolling and HUGE sidewalk cafes. There is a free bus that goes from one end to the other. And at one end of the mall is a light rail stop.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicollet_Mall

The combination of less traffic and more pedestrian space would work perfectly on Grand. Who needs all those lanes??
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by zlohban »

KCJhawker wrote:For a good example of what Grand could potentially be, look to Nicollet Mall in Minneapolis. In the 60s, this 11 block long main downtown street was totally redone into a pedestrain mall. Traffic only has one lane each direction. The extended sidewalk make for easy strolling and HUGE sidewalk cafes. There is a free bus that goes from one end to the other. And at one end of the mall is a light rail stop.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicollet_Mall

The combination of less traffic and more pedestrian space would work perfectly on Grand. Who needs all those lanes??
Never met a traffic mall that I liked, to cold and sterile. Why not just copy our own 47th street? Or Michigan Ave. Chicago. If we lose the automotive traffic we'll have a deader Grand Ave..
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FangKC
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by FangKC »

Yeah, I've always said we have the perfect example of how to make a nice streetscape with the example of W. 47th Street through the Plaza.

I don't know how hopeful to be with this however, because I noticed that some of the plantings in the new streetscaping on W. 12th Street that were recently redone are already dying.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by zlohban »

FangKC wrote:Yeah, I've always said we have the perfect example of how to make a nice streetscape with the example of W. 47th Street through the Plaza.

I don't know how hopeful to be with this however, because I noticed that some of the plantings in the new streetscaping on W. 12th Street that were recently redone are already dying.
No one, even on this forum, can knock Highwoods for their flower and landscape skills, always top notch.
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Re: Make Grand Grand

Post by DaveKCMO »

next public meeting is 6-8pm, tuesday, oct. 18 at the terrace on grand (1520 grand).
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