KCRag Forum

At the end of yesterday's article, AL said they bailed on Westport because they couldn't afford it.

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what I continue to find interesting in NKC HS is more diverse than most of the KCMO schools.

It's roughly 60% white. The southern northland is one place people move to when they leave the KCPSD when they want a quality education.

That's the problem with integration, it doesn't help when the black and Hispanic families that care about education leave. Why would any parent looking for the best schools opportunities want integration south of the river when they can get it and integration in the northland?

flyingember wrote:what I continue to find interesting in NKC HS is more diverse than most of the KCMO schools.

It's roughly 60% white. The southern northland is one place people move to when they leave the KCPSD when they want a quality education.

That's the problem with integration, it doesn't help when the black and Hispanic families that care about education leave. Why would any parent looking for the best schools opportunities want integration south of the river when they can get it and integration in the northland?

That is how I landed in my house. A family of Hispanic descent loved the Westside neighborhood and grew up there, but decided they had to move out of the KCMO school district to get their kid a better education. I live a block away from a public school and a charter school, but I'll assume that most parents of means in the neighborhood do not send their kids to either school. Since the people "of means" are disproportionately white, we have a disproportionate representation of whites and of economic demographics in the public and charter schools in the area. My guess is that there is a stronger correlation of families choosing to leave the KCPSD when compared to family income rather than when compared to race or ethnicity. I could be wrong on that one, but blaming a charter school for doing what other schools in the area can't do (bring in a diverse group of students, economically and racially) seems like the wrong way to go. I'm not the hugest fan of charter schools, but the KCPSD is so messed up, those schoosl are the only way in the short term to take power out of the hands of the people who enjoy the schadenfreude of the whole thing.

flyingember wrote:what I continue to find interesting in NKC HS is more diverse than most of the KCMO schools.

It's roughly 60% white. The southern northland is one place people move to when they leave the KCPSD when they want a quality education.

That's the problem with integration, it doesn't help when the black and Hispanic families that care about education leave. Why would any parent looking for the best schools opportunities want integration south of the river when they can get it and integration in the northland?

they can find diversity also in the more white than KCMO districts like Center, Grandview, and Raytown or in the Northern porition of the SMSD, a lot of parents in the KCMO district who care about education might not have the resources to leave, or time to attend parent conference when they're working 2 minimum wage jobs

you just described the 2010 MARC census population move maps showing the areas with the most black movement into an area 2000-2010.

and there's no way that only parents that have smart kids moved away from urban KC. that's simply impossible.

it's not as simple as caring but not with resources. plenty of low-peforming families doubtless moved away to gain schools with more opportunities for their kids precisely because they work two jobs. access to better after school tutoring programs could be their answer

pash wrote:It's kind of astounding that in a city that's 60% white (in a metro that is 80% white) some people see a single white-majority charter school as some sort of harbinger of re-segregation. Well, it's not so much astounding as it is hard to take that statement at face value—look at the demographics of the KCPSD and try to parse that complaint as anything other than "white people, keep out."

The KCPSD is 9.1% white, in case you were wondering. I suppose the charitable view would hold that the people complaining about Académie Lafayette's whiteness would prefer to see the white students in the KCPS neighborhood schools instead. But I rather doubt it, not least because I'm writing this in reply to an article explaining why the KCPSD's leadership shot down a partnership with AL.

I wish they had mentioned at the top of the article that Clinton Adams was leading the opposition to the deal. Would have saved me 5 minutes of reading time. For years he's been one of the more destructive voices on education in KC.

pash wrote:It's kind of astounding that in a city that's 60% white (in a metro that is 80% white) some people see a single white-majority charter school as some sort of harbinger of re-segregation. Well, it's not so much astounding as it is hard to take that statement at face value—look at the demographics of the KCPSD and try to parse that complaint as anything other than "white people, keep out."

The KCPSD is 9.1% white, in case you were wondering. I suppose the charitable view would hold that the people complaining about Académie Lafayette's whiteness would prefer to see the white students in the KCPS neighborhood schools instead. But I rather doubt it, not least because I'm writing this in reply to an article explaining why the KCPSD's leadership shot down a partnership with AL.

Agree with your larger point but probably worth noting that while KCMO might be 60% white, the portion of the city within the school district is majority black by a large margin. Most of that 30% black population lives in the KCMO school district, which is probably only about 200K people total. So the geography of the KCMO school district is probably in the neighborhood of 70% black.

AL is open to anyone in the KCMSD through a lottery system. If we're asking why more white kids don't go to KCMSD schools, why are we not asking why more black kids aren't going to AL- one of the best schools in the city and open to everyone.

beautyfromashes wrote:AL is open to anyone in the KCMSD through a lottery system. If we're asking why more white kids don't go to KCMSD schools, why are we not asking why more black kids aren't going to AL- one of the best schools in the city and open to everyone.

Very true. I know someone who works there, and she is questioned all the time by parents, mostly in the Brookside area, about a way to get moved up on the list. The only thing she can do is get her own kids in, I think.

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Instead of talking about population of the school district as a whole why not just consider the racial makeup of just school aged children living in the KCMOSD?
Believe years ago there was such a breakdown. What it showed was there were plenty of white school aged children living in the district, especially in the SW attendance area, but there was a large percentage of those kids going to private schools. Of course those kids had a wider selection of schools to choose from plus the family income to take advantage of that option. Believe this was done before the Independence schools left the district.

One other item to consider. Yes, whites flock to AL as an option but what about the racial makeup of other charter schools in the district and add to that the African Studies (?) option at Southeast. Maybe, just maybe, many blacks are choosing to educate their children in a black environment, where they are a majority instead of a minority.

re: students of color enrolling at AL - my understanding is that AL bends over backwards to try and get diverse families to put in for the lottery. it is like pulling teeth. the BKS helicopter parents are all over it and have their kids in the lottery 2 years ahead of time, meanwhile AL reps are going to churches and neighborhood meetings all over the east side trying to get more diverse students to enroll.

when AL first opened it was majority non-white. then as its reputation grew and the school became desirable for the BKS crowd, they mobbed the school and it went to lottery. and to this day they mob the lottery. but AL actively wants to keep around a nice mix to the extent it is possible. (at least that is how it was as of 2013 when my wife was still working at AL).

aknowledgeableperson wrote:If that is the case then all of the schools in the system should be magnet schools and do away with neighborhood schools entirely. At one time the school district had that option. Southwest High and its feeders had the newest and best of everything, the other schools were second class. Except for the black schools, they got the old, out-of-date rejects.

Are you referring to the transfer of teachers in the late 1960s and early 1970s from Central and Paseo to Southwest? The school board did that, possibly with an appearance of racial bias, because (for example) calculus enrollments plummeted at Paseo after its demography changed; Southwest maintained its high enrollments in advanced math, science, and foreign languages until it started to falter after the mid-1970s KCMOSD teachers strike.

As far as physical equipment, Paseo and Central and Southeast (and Westport and Northeast, for that matter) all received similar equipment as Southwest. I'd bet Paseo HS had some of the newest equipment in fact, as it was the most science-oriented HS in the 1950s.

The story of the Kansas City high schools is not pretty, but the school board was not trying to destroy the increasingly black-population high schools in favor of Southwest HS. Rather, Southwest was the last school that clung to high standards, before it too collapsed in the 1970s-1980s. It was a lose-lose proposition, not a zero-sum outcome.

Is there any resource for historical maps of school locations or timelines of what happened when? For someone who did not grow up here, it can be confusing to keep track of what high schools were where, when they closed or what their current status is. Same thing for elementary & middle schools - I was looking at the sale list the other day and had trouble following along.

This article by KCUR gives a general albeit pessimistic outline of the history of the KCMSD since federal desegregation in 1955. Generally, high schools (and their feeder elementary schools) closest to Lincoln High integrated first -- Central and East in the 1950s, then Westport and Paseo in the 1960s, and lastly Northeast, Southeast, and Southwest in the 1970s.

The accompanying map to the article shows all the boundaries just before desegregation.

Are you referring to the transfer of teachers in the late 1960s and early 1970s from Central and Paseo to Southwest? The school board did that, possibly with an appearance of racial bias, because (for example) calculus enrollments plummeted at Paseo after its demography changed; Southwest maintained its high enrollments in advanced math, science, and foreign languages until it started to falter after the mid-1970s KCMOSD teachers strike.

As far as physical equipment, Paseo and Central and Southeast (and Westport and Northeast, for that matter) all received similar equipment as Southwest. I'd bet Paseo HS had some of the newest equipment in fact, as it was the most science-oriented HS in the 1950s.

The story of the Kansas City high schools is not pretty, but the school board was not trying to destroy the increasingly black-population high schools in favor of Southwest HS. Rather, Southwest was the last school that clung to high standards, before it too collapsed in the 1970s-1980s. It was a lose-lose proposition, not a zero-sum outcome.

No, I referring to a time before that, primarily before the Brown decision. Southwest was the premier school for the district, especially considering the neighborhoods in its attendance area. The other "white" schools were also taken care of to a degree. However the "black" school, ie Lincoln, was a stepchild and received the hand-me-downs from the other schools.

The KCMOSD was much like the health care system in the city. There was General Hospital for whites and General Hospital #2 for blacks.

Southwest High School was given greater resources than any other school in the district during 1967-1971. Investment and maintenance of physical plant alone made this obvious.

Perhaps the school district was not out to destroy the black schools in the district, but they were obvious in their intent to spend as few dollars on their operations as they could get away with.

Manual High School was given the least of all and was the obvious poor house of the district. An eighty year old relic with a hundred years of deferred investment. It was a miserable, gloomy and sad place.

East High and Central were the next lower rungs on the ladder. Paseo followed, with Northeast and Westport receiving a bit better attention, favor and operational attention.

Van Horn High was in another category entirely. It was the newest of the district schools and evidently was the poster child for KCMo's ability to compete with suburban districts.

Southwest was the jewel of the district and it is understood that in that time it had to be. Pem Day and Sunset Schools were immediately proximate and aspired to by much of that population. The call of Shawnee Missions growing allure had to be recognized.

This was all clearly recognized, understood and generally accepted. The social and political structure was firmly established and the ability of average (or less than average on the 'Nichols Scale'..) people to affect change was not yet the norm.

Edit: I left out Lincoln, which in those years was operating somewhere between Manual and East/Central. Also forgot Southeast, which surprised us in that it was better kept and seemed 'richer' until about 1969 and then it dropped precipitously in appearance and operation.

I was scanning the front page of The Call this morning and the lead article was about the SWHS deal. It referred to it as "the deal that would have jeopardized Lincoln Prep", and talked about "massive opposition" to it. AL was clearly portrayed as the enemy. It was not anything I'd seen mentioned by the Star before Monday's article.

So apparently everyone thinks the KCPS Board is nuts, but for exactly opposite reasons.